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The will of John DOWNES, a widower,  watchmaker of St James Street, Clerkenwell, written 10 July 1817, proved in 1828 names children

John DOWNES, Thos. Will DOWNES, Mary Ann DOWNES, Ann Hepzibah DOWNES and Elizth. DAVIES.  (I attach her name just incase I am wrong about that).


I have found baptisms for all except Elizabeth, and I also cannot see a marriage to Mr Davies for her.   
Dates for the others  (with parents John and Elizabeth) are

John 10 May 1778.   (St Martin in the Fields).    Although, I am not happy about the location.
Joseph 21 Nov 1784 (St James, Clerkenwell)
Thomas William 11 Nat 1786 (St James. Clerkenwell)
Mary Ann 14 Aug 1791 (St James Clerkenwell)
Ann Hephzibah 14 June 1795 (St James Clerkenwell)


I THINK the parents are  the marriage of Elizabeth WILDBORE and John DOWNES.  28 December 1769 at St James Clerkenwell.   Elizabeth is 13 years or older. Married with approval of her father.  Tobias.
And she is, I think the burial at Spa Fields on 23 Nov 1795

So - She might not have been mature enough to have children very early in the marriage, but I think there should be some before the 1778 baptism of John (whose birth date is on the register as 21 April 1778 assuming he is theirs).  So I assume Elizabeth falls in there somewhere.

Anyway, can anyone see Elizabeth’s baptism and her marriage, and another contender for John.   

Many thanks

I am fairly sure that the Mr & Mrs Downes & family named here

https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/NENZC18571121.2.5?end_date=31-12-1857&items_per_page=100&phrase=2&query=Downes+and+family&snippet=true&sort_by=byDA&start_date=01-01-1857

for Nelson on the John McVicar/MacVicar are the people I am looking for,  but of course I would like to see the actual manifest.   So far I am not having any luck finding it.

There is the diary of the Turnbulls  here https://natlib.govt.nz/records/22391899.

But an actual passenger list eludes me

Thank you

Apologies for the length of this. I tried to abbreviate it 

One of my Great Grandmother’s sisters  Charlotte Annie (Nancy) ANSCOMBE ‘Ran away with the butler  (Mr Wilson) to America”  “She and GGM were very close and wrote to each other every regularly until they died.”
“in WW2 she asked if her son could visit them (in Kent) when on leave, but he never did.”


Charlotte Annie ANSCOMBE was born 27 April 1868, Edenbridge, Kent. had an illegitimate son Alec Arthur ANSCOMBE 

(GRO 1904 J Qtr, St Geo Hanover Sq. Vol 01A page 477)  I do not have this certificate

1 June 1905 Oceanic arrives NY

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JFHJ-LZ8

on passenger list are

Charlotte A. WILSON  37 yrs 6 mths  wife. last perm residence Cambridge   to NY.  going to husband.  Alfred Harvey WILSON, Mansion House Hotel 478 4th Ave NY

Alec Arthur age 10 months.   

Charlotte was actually  37y 1 month so ages are not 100% accurate

I do not think Charlotte and Arthur ever married. he was a lot older than her - born about 1850

Charlotte and Arthur had another child. Olive Grace in 1907 NY.  I can account for her, marriage and death.

Arthur died 1917 (I think, certainly by 1923 when Charlotte applied for naturalization) and Charlotte Annie in 1942

 
I cannot find Charlotte Annie in 1940.  She is not at the 1930 address. 

In 1930 census for Los Angeles

at 946 3/4 West 85th Street

Charlotte A. WILSON  head.  Renting. b England
Alec A  WILSON son 25 b England, Carpenter’s Helper at Elec. Power . Plant
Olive G.  dau 23 b N.Y. Saleswoman, department store



and here is where I am very confused.

1940

at 946 W 85th St

Alec WILSON head 35 married b RHODE ISLAND
Esther WILSON 40  married b Mexico
William son 23 b California

WW2 draft card for an Alex Arthur WILSON  gives dob of 30 May 1904, Providence Rhode Island, Person who will always know how to contact him is J Ybarra of 902 W85th St


at 902 W85th in 1920 is


Josephine Ybarra 48 wd.      all b Mexico except last
Alfonso 13 son
Esther WILSON 23  dau  Divorced
William grandson.  3 0/12   birth place of father MISSOURI



and in 1930

Mary J Ybarra
other family and
Esther B WILSON 32, Divorced
George W. WILSON 13    birth place of father MISSOURI


George William WILSON’s draft card names his mother Esther of 946 W85th St and gives birth of 18 Jan 1917 

Alec Arthur WILSON dob 30 May 1904 died 17 Jan 1977


So.  1. Am I safe to ignore the amazing change in birth place and claim the one apparently born Rhode Island as one and the same as the one born in London?

        2.  How is Esther WILSON connected to the family?  Who was she divorced from?  Alec Arthur cannot be the  father of George William, he would have been only 12
Is there a marriage for her to either WILSON?

       3. Can anyone see Charlotte in 1940?

Mary was the daughter of Sir Robert HAMILTON of Silvertonhill and his wife Eliz. Baillie.

trees have her marrying Sir John SOMERVILLE of Cambusnethan, but this does not look at all like Somerville or Cambusnethan to me.

Is it ELVINSTONE?   And what is the place?

I think it is STEVENSON.   Still can't figure out the place

Harriet was baptised at Gnosall, Staffs on 18 March 1832. Parents Thomas and Harriet.  She was 9th of 11 children all baptised there.

Harriet married John KEBLE at Gnosall on 9 October 1854. She was a servant and he was a labourer. John names no father, but he did sign his name, as did a witness James KEBLE and another, Sarah MADELEY.   Harriet marked.
 
After that I cannot find them anywhere. It is Harriet whom I want to dispatch on the tree. I have not found a likely death  in the first five years after their marriage.

I do not believe she is the Harriet KIBBLE death in 1859, Newport as there is a Harriet KIBBLE who that could be.

I have looked in the usual places and  checked Gnosall records at http://www.gnosallhistory.co.uk/church_records.htm  and see no death for Harriet nor baptisms for children of them.

 Can anyone see them?
 Thank you