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Messages - marc roberts

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19
Bedfordshire Lookup Requests / Re: ROWNEY families in Beds. in 1600's
« on: Tuesday 06 May 08 05:39 BST (UK)  »
Thanks Cathy.

So far I've found the ROWLEY and ROWNEY families to be quite distinct. I often look at ROWLEY information "just in case" but can't remember ever finding a ROWNEY who had become a ROWLEY or the other way around. Not saying it didn't happen, or that there probably aren't some isolated records where a mistake may have been made, but I can't remember seeing many. There are quite a few variations on the ROWNEY name which do come up from time to time however - ROWNIE, ROWNY, RONEY, ROUNIE, etc., now I will look more carefully at ROWNING too, which I hadn't noticed before.

Marc

20
Bedfordshire Lookup Requests / Re: ROWNEY families in Beds. in 1600's
« on: Monday 05 May 08 18:34 BST (UK)  »
Thank you again, David. I guess that means we can say with a fair degree of confidence that the ROWNEY family were not living in Bedfordshire in 1671. That is very helpful indeed.

It is curious that the "ROWNEY" variation on the name seems to overwhelmingly prevail in Bedfordshire, but the "ROWNING" version seems equally predominant in Cambridgeshire.

Who was your great uncle in Great Gransden? I'll keep him in mind.

Marc

21
Bedfordshire Lookup Requests / Re: ROWNEY families in Beds. in 1600's
« on: Monday 05 May 08 17:27 BST (UK)  »
Thanks very much for that, Cathy.

I've only identified two William ROWNEYs who seem to have been alive and able for such service; one was the son of Jonathan of Potton, who married in Potton in 1766, aged 26, raised his family and died there in 1790; the other was a grandson of John and Judith of Langford, who was married in 1758 at age 27 and seems to have been living with his wife and having children at Southill between 1759 and 1775, and who died in 1797 (I'm not sure where). It would seem, if it was one of those two men, that they didn't spend too long away from home in their service, so they probably didn't go far.

I've looked a few times at A2A over the years and found a couple of very interesting ROWNEY records (including the one David mentioned - thank you David). One record (Susannah ROWNEY of Goldington) you pointed out a year or so ago, Cathy, was my ancestor, and with that land title information I was (with the help of Peter and Trevor at the Records Office) able to track down the location of her cottage (now long gone) when I visited England briefly in 2006. For that I am very thankful indeed. I'm living in Australia and was able to make some very interesting discoveries in the few days I had available in Bedford, mostly thanks to the particularly helpful staff at the Records Office there. I did get a will for Jonathan ROWNEY of Potton, but unfortunaltely it doesn't shed any light on his origins or possible connections to other families in the area.

Many thanks,

Marc

22
Bedfordshire Lookup Requests / Re: ROWNEY families in Beds. in 1600's
« on: Monday 05 May 08 17:03 BST (UK)  »
Thank you very much for checking that for me, David. I'm familiar with the ROWLEY families you mention because they present as a potential complication, but to date I haven't identified any cross-overs that I can recall, so it looks like my ROWNEYs weren't in the 1671 Hearth Tax returns. Can you tell me please whether the 1671 returns included the names of the occupants of all houses, or just the owner of the houses (who presumably paid the tax). I understand that in some cases only the owners who paid the taxes were recorded, but in other cases even the poorest families may have been recorded if they occupied a house.

The possible Branson ROWNING(E) connection in Little Gransden you found looks very interesting indeed. I will certainly check that out very carefully. I know some of the Langford ROWNEY family found their way to Gamlingay for brief time, and others drifted across that way later too.

I've also just noticed a submitted IGI entry which must be fairly recent showing a George ROWNEY marrying a Judith in Langford in 1664. I don't recall seeing this in the OPR, and the lack of any specific date makes me skeptical.

Thanks again for your help,

Marc

23
Bedfordshire Lookup Requests / ROWNEY families in Beds. in 1600's
« on: Monday 05 May 08 08:45 BST (UK)  »
I've located who I believe to be the earliest ROWNEY name bearers in Bedfordshire OPR. The details are following, but there is a simple question at the end:

John ROWNEY with wife Judith who were having children in the parish of Langford from 1691-1711.

Mary ROWNEY who married Robert FORTESCUE (or FOSCUE) in Potton in 1686, they had two children there, then Mary was buried there in 1689.

Elizabeth ROWNEY ("wife of John ROWNEY") buried in Biggleswade in 1706.

Elizabeth ROWNEY married Henry HALL in 1708 in Biggleswade. They have three children there between 1709 and 1715.

Braunston (or Braumston) ROWNEY marr. Elizabeth HUCKLE in Sutton in 1723 and they have children there between 1723 and 1739.

Jonathan ROWNEY marr. Mary BIRD in Potton in 1729, then apparently remarries (Mrs Frances WAGSTAFF) in 1731 and they are having children in Potton up until 1740.

The naming of children suggests Jonathan and Braunston were related.

John ROWNEY marr. Elizabeth HEWITT in Blunham in 1719, they have a son in Sandy in 1721 and then John apparently dies and was buried in Sandy in 1725. Elizabeth is buried in Sandy as a widow in 1739.

Another John ROWNEY and an Elizabeth ROWNEY are both buried in Biggleswade in 1737. They are thought to have been the married son and unmarried daughter of John and Judith (above), but this is not certain.

***

Looking at all of the above it seems entirely possible that a single ROWNEY family living somewhere around Biggleswade in the mid 1600's could be responsible for bringing the relatively uncommon ROWNEY surname to Bedfordshire. The parishes with known early ROWNEY presence in rough chronological order seem to be Potton, Langford, Biggleswade, Blunham (one marriage), Sandy, Sutton, Dunton, Northill, and Southill.

I was hoping that someone with access to records from the 1600's such as Poll Tax or Hearth Tax, may be able to check to see whether any ROWNEY families/households appear, and if so, where and how many? I'm not sure how the records are organized, so a search of the above parishes would hopefully be sufficient to answer the question, although a countywide result would obviously be more conclusive.

Any information at all on the very early ROWNEY families in Bedfordshire would be invaluable.

Many thanks and best wishes,
Marc Roberts

24
Thanks very much for checking that Alli. That is the correct marriage. I have obtained the certificate, which unfortunately was a transcription rather than a copy, but confirms the details you have provided.

John WARD's age was given as 69 in the Index of deaths in South Australia. He died in 1887, which means he should have been 35 rather than 25 when he married. There is a submitted entry in the IGI showing a christening of a John WARD in St Philip & St Jacob in Bristol in 1829 with parents John and Elizabeth WARD which would support the marriage age of 25 if it was the same person. The marriage certificate does name John's father as a labourer named John WARD. So I am inclined at this stage to suspect a transcription error in the SA Deaths Index ("69" instead of "59"), but have not yet confirmed this from the actual death certificate.

I have also located the family of Uriah and Elizabeth HOARE in Dorset. Martha was christened in the parish of Abbotsbury on 25 Feb 1826. There are ten children in all in Uriah's family christened in Abbotsbury. Uriah HOARE was buried in Abbotsbury on 8 Oct 1836. He died aged 43 years. His origins are unknown to me. His wife Elizabeth died in Abbotsbury on 28 Apr 1853 and was buried there on 3 May 1853. I haven't found any marriage information for Uriah and Elizabeth. Their first known child was baptised in Abbotsbury in 1819. The 1851 census suggests that Elizabeth was born in St Brides London around 1793.

Thanks for the lead Lydart. Uriah and Elizabeth's family seems to have scattered to the winds by the 1850's, so it is possible there may be connections. There appears to have been a couple of concentrations of HOARE families in Dorset in the 1800's.

Thanks and best wishes,
Marc

25
Bedfordshire / Re: Are any of these names in your tree?
« on: Monday 24 September 07 08:25 BST (UK)  »
Susannah KING married Edward ROWNEY at Bletsoe on 12 Feb 1794

John HOW married Jane ROWNEY at Blunham on 31 Jan 1806

John CHURCH (of Milton Ernest) married Rebecca ROWNEY at Bletsoe on 3 Oct 1855

George CHURCH (of Milton Ernest) married Elizabeth ROWNEY in Bedford District in 1854.

Emma FENSOM married William ROWNEY (of Bletsoe) in Saint Neots District in 1871.

***

Would be interested if connected to any of the above.

26
Thank you very much for your message, Louise.

At this stage I don't think it is likely to be the same William CHRISTIAN, however I'm still very interested in a possible connection with your CHRISTIAN family. My William's death certificate from 1850 claims that he was 54 years old (ie. born c.1796) when he died, and the 1841 census indicates that he was born in Lincolnshire.

I have not yet connected the John CHRISTIAN from Pointon, who was a carpenter (aged 20+ in 1841), with my family. Might he possibly be connected with your family? That might in turn suggest other possible connections between the two CHRISTIAN families. William and Susannah of Pointon used the names John and Eliza twice (the first children bearing those names died in infancy), although no children were named Elizabeth. The name Emma seems to have some kind of tradition in my CHRISTIAN family, so the sister in your family with that name is an interesting similarity.

I'll contact you privately with my e-mail address.

Thanks again and best wishes,

Marc

27
Thank you so much for that, Alli. It finally clarifies a long-running mystery about the fate of William CHRISTIAN (jr) for me. I'd always assumed that he must have died in infancy, and was amazed when I recently found him with a wife in the 1851 census.

Best wishes,
Marc

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