Another opinion needed - which Mary?

[lesleyhannah]

My 3g-grandfather Edmund Maltby's wife is described on his son's birth certificate as Mary Maltby, formerly Bowes. Edmund was born Newbiggin. They lived in Falsgrave after their marriage.

On the 1851 census she's shown Mary Maltby, aged 47 born Scalby.  By 1861 Edmund's a widower. I can't find Mary's death.

I've been trying to find Mary's birth on the LDS site. There are two Marys born about the right time in the Scarborough area and I'd like to hear someone else's opinion about which (if either) is most likely to be my g-g-g-.

The first Mary Bowes is born 1803 in Scarborough, Bts (I don't know what Bts stands for). Her parents are George Bowes and Elizabeth, who I found in Falsgrave on the 1851 census. Elizabeth was born Scalby.

The other Mary is Mary Merry Bowes born to Bridge Bowes - no father given - 1808 Scalby.

My problem is I don't know exactly when my Mary was born, so either of these dates is possible. The second Mary is born Scalby, which is the right place, but my Mary didn't use a middle name on the census.

The first Mary doesn't have a 2nd name, but I don't know whether Scarborough Bts could be the same as Scalby.

Could anyone help please?

Thank you - I'll be very grateful.

[Valda]

Scarborough BTs means Bishop's transcripts for Scarborough. each parish was required by the Bishop to send yearly copies of their registers. Where the Bishop's transcripts have survived they are usually held at the relevant local record office. It is the entries from the BTs for Scarborough that are on the IGI not the parish registers themselves.

Merry as a middle name on a baptism is perhaps indicating the child's father's surname. You have an index entry to a baptism and the year of baptism is not necessarily the birth year of the child. The actual parish entry might or might not give the child's birthdate or age if she was older than a baby.

Regards
Valda


Regards
Valda

[JAP]

Hi lesleyhannah,

As Valda so rightly points out, both the entries are christening entries, not birth entries, so the year of birth is just conjecture.

*Mary <Bowes>, bap 28 Aug 1803, Scarborough,Bts, ,Yorkshire, parents George Bowes and Elizabeth.
This is one of those infuriating christening batches (either 'C' as in this case, or 'I') which have relatively recently come into the IGI and which give no information whatsoever about their source!   And I'm not all that confident about them as I found a place name for one such batch which was completely wrong - obviously the place (parish and county) had been entered incorrectly on the first entry and then just "filled down" through the whole batch!
 
*Mary Merry BOWES, bap 2 Aug 1808, Scalby near Scarborough, mother Bridget BOWES
This one does give its source - and the film notes in the Family History Library catalogue on FamilySearch seem to indicate that it is the Register of the Parish Church of 'Scalby (near Scarborough)', Bishop's Transcripts.

One or neither of these could be the Mary who married Edmund MALTBY.

Mary Merry sounded a strange combination of forenames to me but a search on FreeBMD for all event, just enter forenames Mary Merry, actually came up with some hits...

Given Mary's age of 47 in the 1851 census, it seems very likely that she would have married before the start of statutory registration - supported if the children in the 1851 census are Mary's (as well as Edmund's) also from their ages (which range from 17 down to 7).

Sad to say, it looks as though Mary might be a brick wall unless you are fortunate enough to come across the marriage entry in a church register which has not been entered into the IGI - and even then it might not have anything to give a clue to her birth.

JAP

[lesleyhannah]

Thank you both. I have learnt something new - I'd never met  the word Bt before - thought it was somewhere in Scarborough!

Have just this morning received Mary Maltby's death cert - I wasn't sure it would be the right person, but says 'wife of Edmund Maltby' - aged 40 in 1858. Living Dixon's Yard Dumple. Once again they don't give a middle name. I'm more or less discounting Mary Merry Bowes now.

Unfortunately I won't be able to get to Scarborough to read the original transcripts so I'm very grateful for the help you've given me.

Thanks
Lesley

[JAP]

Dear Lesley,

Don't discount anything - children were often baptized/christened many years after birth.

Not that the baptismal entries will necessarily or even likely provide any useful info.

As for ages at death!  One of my Ggmas had conveniently dropped at the very least 10 years when she died - an age-reduction tradition which has followed through with her descendants (including yours truly - no, I can't lie about my age, I just don't give it!)

You can always order in the relevant film(s) of the registers/transcripts to your nearest LDS Family History centre - locations can be found at:
http://www.familysearch.org

But whether the baptism entries will be of any use is anyone's guess ...

Very best of luck

JAP

[Valda]

Illegitimate children do not always hang onto (or even know they had in the first place) a middle name that indicated their father's surname, if in this case that is what the name Merry is indicating. Illegitimate children's mothers move on, marry someone else, there is no contact with the original father and the middle name is long forgotten. It all means just because there was a middle name on the baptism you can't assume its absence means that it isn't the same person. Mary may have strongly wished to disassociate herself from a father who had (potentially) deserted her and her mother.

However if the IGI only has coverage for Scalby through BT's and that is probably only intermittent coverage (my Philimore's atlas says Scalby parish registers are not on the IGI) then it would be wise to do as JAP suggests and order the microfilm of the baptismal register for Scalby and check it right through for the whole period, or contact the local record office or family history society to see whether there is a transcript for Scalby parish register which can easily be searched. The original registers will be in the record office not at Scarborough.

The 1851 census clearly indicates Mary Maltby was 47 at the time of the census night. If she really was 40 in 1858 when she died and she was the mother of the eldest child who appears on the 1851 census, Thomas born  Falsgrave and aged 17, then she was only 16 when Thomas was born (according to the IGI baptised 21st May 1834 Scarborough - though the 1851 census says born Falsgrave which is a good example of you don't always get baptised where you were born, if the 1851 census is correct on his birthplace). The legal age for marriage for girls with parental permission was 14 but marrying this young was pretty rare.
Information isn't always correct on certificates. A grieving relative and a very busy registrar were not always conducive to getting all the details right.

There is by the way a potential marriage for a Bridget Bowes in 1809 in Thorpe Bassett which isn't to far away but in East Riding. The subsequent children were all born in the area. On the 1851 census Bridget's widower was in Duggleby which is between Scarborough and Bridlington but inland.

Regards
Valda