Could my Hartherns be Harderns?

[lizcake]

I've traced back to John Harthen, living in Hankelow, b. about 1811 at Coole Pitate in the 1861, in the 1851 he is John Hardern, born Acton, living in Hough, in the 1871 the is Harthern, his son Thomas, b. 1838 at Shavington. I have been supplied with  a John Hardern in the 1841 living in Shavington, but this is not the same person as the 1851, is anyone else out there dealing with these names, or anyone have any snippit of info from 1851 or before? Parish records for this area, and Audlem (another area of interest for me) seen to be very closely guarded, or am I just not looking in the right places? Thanks all, Liz 

[Big-Al]

Hi Liz
I have been searching around the villages again for Harthern in 1841 and I came across another John .

1841 Shavington -cum-Greasly .HO 107/118/25

John Harthern Age 25 Ag Lab born in the county of Cheshire

Could this be your one ? in the 1841 census ages were rounded down to the nearest multiply of 5 ,I think .

He seemed to be just on his own no other family members .

Big Al

[lizcake]

Hi Big Al, not sure on this on, certainly John worked on the land, in 1851 he is described as a farmer of 11 acres, but he must have been married at this time to Martha, and his son Thomas was born in 1838.I could do with a look at some Parish records, but none seem available online.....unless anyone knows differently!!

[bogstandard]

I am related to the Harderns, around the Crewe, Worleston area. They are linked to this family tree http://www.halbop.btinternet.co.uk/main.htm

[lizcake]

Thanks for that lead, I followed your tree, and the looked at Philip Ardern, and now my head is reeling with all the info that turned up! When you say that you are related to the Hardern tree, have they remained Harderns throughout, or have you come across a change to Hartherns? All these Hartherns being Hardern who were Arderns has left me in dire need of any help that I can get to establish a link, I never thought when I started this lark that thinks would get so convoluted, I was naive enough to think that Harthern was a fairly unusual name and so would aid my task!
Liz

[bogstandard]

My great grandparents were Thomas Hardern and Mary Jones, they had 13 children, my line is through Lily (not yet listed as being traced. I cannot contact the Hales-Owen family yet).
It was this family that brought (H)ardern to the Crewe area.
There are only (up until now) 8 lines established from them, so with mine it makes 9. That leaves 4 to trace.
Please bear in mind that if these people in the late 19th century were not that well educated (or a slightly deaf vicar) there could easily be a name change.
Crewe is only about 10 miles from Audlem, and being a farming community people can easily relocate within the area.
Sorry if this has bent your mind further (I get my niece to do all the figuring) but I was just trying to give you another option.

[bogstandard]

Just been looking at your original post
The timeline doesn't match up to mine.
But looking at the location you are searching (I live in Crewe and travel through Audlem all the time)
Hankelow is about 2 miles from Audlem, there was a church there, but I think it is being remodernised (maybe to dwellings)
Coole Pilate is about 3 miles on the Market Drayton side, and that might have been covered by Adderley Church.
If you don't live in the area it might be worth a visit, you could cover Audlem church and the two I mentioned in a few hours. A trip to the local hostelries proves a good source.

[lizcake]

Once more, thanks for the suggestions, Have you had any contact with Steve Brown, on ARDERN-admin@rootsweb.com? he has suggested to me that he thinks the name Hardern derives from Hordern, not Arderne, the waters get even muddier - and I think I'm drowning!!!
Liz

[bogstandard]

In my case Hardern came from Ardern, mainly through lack of education, in the early 1800's. My Ardern's were silk weavers in Macclesfield and then became farmers under a different name in this area.
Best of luck with your search, maybe our paths will cross somewhere else in the realms of time.