Why would a Colyton couple get married in Bethnal Green?

[Burrow Digger]

I have the following marriage

Marriages Jun 1846
Matthews  Robert Hunt     Bethnal Gn.  2 14   
WHITE  Catherine     Bethnal Gn  2 14   


In all census records from 1851 onwards Robert and Catherine were consistent about their birthplaces. They were both born in Colyton near Axminster.   So why would they have gone to Bethnal Green (Middlesex) to get married?

As far as I can tell, the first child was born in Colyton in 1847

BD

[PaulineJ]

Since you don't have the certificate to hand to give ages, occupations, then there is nothing to indicate that this is anything other than a co-incidence. Only buying the cert will give you any confidence that you _may_ have the correct record ref there.

Pauline

[Valda]

Because one of them was already there because of work is the most likely reason.

From the IGI
Marriage:  15 JUN 1846   Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London
ROBERT HUNT MATTHEWS 
Father:  ROBERT MATTHEWS 
CATHERINE WHITE 
Father:  ROBERT WHITE 

ROBERT HUNT MATTHEWS 
Christening:  06 APR 1827   Colyton, Devon
Father:  ROBERT MATTHEWS 
Mother:  JANE 

ROBERT MATTHEWS 
Spouse:  JANE HUNT 
Marriage:  06 APR 1826   Colyton, Devon

CATHERINE WHITE 
Christening:  08 AUG 1824   Colyton, Devon
Father:  ROBERT WHITE 
Mother:  PRISCILLA 

1841 census HO107 214/4 folio 5 page 4
High Street Colyton  Devon
Robert Matthews 58  Devon Grocer
Jane Matthews 49 Devon
Robert Matthews 14  Devon
Henry Matthews 10 Devon
Edwin Matthews 8  Devon
Alfred Matthews 6  Devon

1841 census HO107 214/4 folio 4 page 2
High Street Colyton  Devon   
Robert White 50  Devon Butcher
Priscilla White 45 Devon
George White 20 Devon
Catherine White 15  Devon
Henry White 13  Devon Shoe apprentice
Edmund White 11  Devon

Regards

Valda

[Arranroots]

I wondered whether Robert might have been apprenticed in Bethnal Green (he would presumably have needed the permission of his master to marry?)

Googling found this:

A large vellum indenture dated 17th June 1873 relating to property in Honiton between William Wheaton, formerly of Honiton now of Exeter (merchant) and Robert Hunt Matthews (ironmonger).  Earlier indentures are cited with the following people mentioned: 1850  Henry Charles Mules (died Dec 1862), Horace Vibart Mules  1870 Julian Goldomid, Henry Matthews  1857 Richard Miller and John Starke.  Has two signatures and seals with a revenue stamp.  On the reverse are witness and received signatures.  Has been folded.

From http://www.rootschat.com/links/0md/


I wonder whether searching the local record office might produce evidence of an apprenticeship.

I know of others who have been apprenticed well away from home.

kind regards, Arranroots 

[Valda]

Father Robert Matthews' Prerogative Court of Canterbury will, may also rule out or rule in any close relatives in London on the Matthews side at least. The marriage itself may give clues to which spouse was living in London, though of course you only needed three weeks residency to be of parish.

Will of Robert Matthews, Ironmonger of Colyton , Devon 14 August 1845 PROB 11/2023

Regards

Valda

[Burrow Digger]

I finally found this family in 1881 census - in Middlesex. 

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Robert Hunt Matthews died in Honiton in 1875

Thanks for your ideas about the apprenticeship.  If Robert was apprenticed in London, then a removal to London makes sense after he died, right??

Now to find a removal record.

I found all the census records from 1841 through 1871 - the family (grew to 12 kids) all in Devon

BD

[Valda]

It could just as easily be Catherine who worked as a servant in London or was staying with other family members, than Robert serving an apprenticeship in London. Robert wouldn't need to be apprenticed outside his family because his father seems to have been an ironmonger so he could have easily been apprenticed to his father. It might well be that it was Catherine who had the London connections. She was the one that moved her family to London after her husband's death.
You need a copy of the marriage certificate to try and establish who was living in London.
If Robert's father left a Prerogative Court of Canterbury will you would expect the Matthews family to be reasonably well off.

A removal order would only occur if a family was completely destitute. The removal would be to last place the father (the wife assumed the settlement of her husband on marriage) was established and earning money - in this case in Devon for many years.
On the 1881 census you have the widow of Robert and her family with 4 children in employment and seemingly able to support themselves. Unless Robert went bankrupt they would have had money from his business when he died and if they didn't the widow and younger children would require the financial support of Honiton parish whose responsibility they would be. There seems absolutely no evidence that in anyway this family was destitute. The evidence points in the other direction.

The 1891 census confirms the family were financially reasonably well placed.

1891 census RG12 196 folio 119
121 Rendlesham Road Hackney  London   
Frederick J Matthews 30 Honiton, Devon,  Head  Single Corn Merchant
Catherine Matthews 67 Colyton, Devon,  Mother  Widow living on her own means
Hannah M Matthews 36 Colyton, Devon,  Sister 

Deaths Jun 1891
Matthews  Catherine  68  Hackney  1b 390

Regards

Valda

[Burrow Digger]

Thank you so much for that info and the 1891 census, Valda.
It's very much appreciated.

BD

[Valda]

As Robert was underage at the time of his marriage he would have needed his father's permission to marry. If he didn't have it marrying far away in London could have been another the reason the couple married 'anonymously' there.
Until you see the marriage record with witnesses and parishes I'm afraid any reason for them marrying in London is speculative. Even with the marriage certificate there may not be enough further information to say why the marriage took place in London.

On the 1851 census there were 73 people born Colyton living in the London area.

One Matthews
John Matthews 47  Colyton, Devon,  Head  St Luke Old Street Married Capenter 

and four Whites
Lawrence White 56 Colyton, Devon, Head  St Marylebone  Middlesex  Married Butterman
Fanny White 38  Colyton, Devon, Wife  St Marylebone  Middlesex Married 

and
Henry White 44  Colyton, Devon,  Servant  Bethnal Green  Middlesex  married Potman 

plus
Peter White 58 Colyton, Devon, Head  Westminster St James Married Billiard Table maker

so lots of potential relatives, not including any married females with other surnames.

Regards

Valda