Where does my line end?

[Adrian Smith]

Hello all - Happy New Year.

Can anyone tell me where my line ends?  I believe my ancestor to be William Hemens, born 1809 in Winscombe.  The parish record reveals that  his mother was Elisabeth Hemens who had previously been married to [probably still was] and had children with Paul; however, William is listed as a base chile....

D   M   Year   Christ'd   sex   Father   Mother      Comments
10   Jul   1803   Elisabeth   d   Paul   Elisabeth   
1   Oct   1805   David   s   Paul   Elisabeth   
26   Jun   1808   Ann   d   Paul   Elisabeth   
5   Nov   1809   William   s      Elisabeth                 base chile

So, even though I know who her husband was, I have no idea who was William's father. 

My question is this; does this effectively end the Hemens line, or shouldn't William even be included in my tree as his listed surname is not derived from his father?

[Valda]

Legally you can and always could be known by any name you chose to be known as.

Have you checked with Somerset Record Office to see whether they hold for instance a 'filiation order' or more what was more commonly known as a 'bastardy bond' where the parish sought a maintenance order on the father for the upkeep of the child so the cost did not fall of the parish rate payers for his upkeep. Unless of course Paul was prepared to support him, but if this was the same Elizabeth Hemens, the wife of Paul (and not another Elizabeth Hemens, Paul's sister/cousin for instance?) then it rather looks like Paul was 'out of the picture' in someway from the parish entry. Married women with husbands at home didn't have baseborn children (present genetic research seems to indicate that a lot more children than was thought, were not the products of their 'fathers', but of course the married women concerned were not going about telling their husbands this and the children were baptised or their births registered as the legitimate offspring of the married couple). If not and the husband was openly 'a cuckold' you might have expected a further comment in the parish register on the baptism of the child.

Regards

Valda

[Adrian Smith]

I just had a reply from Somerset Archive & Records Service - No filiation order    Now I'm really stuck.  There are overseers' of the poor accounts for Winscombe covering the relevant period; is it likely that there would be a reference to Elisabeth or William?

[Valda]

The family might be mentioned if they were paupers, but that doesn't mean there would be any reference to who the child's father was, just the payments the family received.

http://www.mdlp.co.uk/resources/general/poor_law.htm

Did Elizabeth remarry?

Regards

Valda

[Adrian Smith]

Valda

I can't find a re-marriage for Elisabeth.  Nor can I find a death for either Elisabeth or Paul in the PRs.

A. 

[Valda]

Adrian

How have you tracked your ancestor back to William Hemens baptised 1809 in Winscombe? What is your direct line from William? The William of the right age in Winscombe on the 1841 census seems on later censuses to give his birthplace as the adjacent parish of Bishop Compton?

How do you know that the Elizabeth who had a base child called William in 1809 in Winscombe was the same woman as Elizabeth the wife of Paul having children in the village earlier and a child later with her husband?

Winscombe baptism 21st June 1813
Lydia Hemens daughter of Paul and Elizabeth Winscombe labourer

There is a Lydia Hemens aged 25 (adult ages over 15 ususally rounded down to the nearest 5 on the 1841 census) an Ann Hemens aged 30 and an Elizabeth Hemens aged 70 with three young children in Winscombe on the 1841 census.

Have you checked the Compton Bishop parish registers for Hemens entries?

Regards

Valda

[Adrian Smith]

Adrian

How have you tracked your ancestor back to William Hemens baptised 1809 in Winscombe? What is your direct line from William? The William of the right age in Winscombe on the 1841 census seems on later censuses to give his birthplace as the adjacent parish of Bishop Compton?

Hi Valda,

I trace my line to William via my grandfather Charles William Hemens 9 Jan 1890, Winscombe > George Upshall Hemens 13 Jan 1835, Winscombe > William Hemens Abt 1809, Compton Bishop.  I can find no Hemens in the Compton Bishop registers.

How do you know that the Elizabeth who had a base child called William in 1809 in Winscombe was the same woman as Elizabeth the wife of Paul having children in the village earlier and a child later with her husband?

Good question; I don't.  At this stage I am investigating possibilities but I can find no other Elisabeth of a the right age in the area.  I'll admit that I'm probably getting too fixated on Elisabeth but she has become my 'brick wall'.  I probably need to take a step back and get a fresh perspective on this as I'm probably missing something obvious.

Many thanks for your wise words which have brought me down to earth 

Regards,

Adrian.

[lizdb]

Adrian, I have no answer to your dillema, just empathy!

My Edmonds line goes back to early 1700's and ends in exactly the same way.
The last confirmed event we have is the marriage of James Edmonds to Sarah Ead in 1713.
After extensive searching, the most likely candidate for this James is a christening in a neighbouring parish. The entry in the parish register is in LAtin (!) and the translation we have managed to get reads as follows:

"James, son of MAry Edmonds and (as claimed by MAry) of Ralph Edmonds, her former husband, who went away on the day of the annuciation of the Virgin Mary in 1676 and who she declared to be dead two years ago, and is now rumoured to come and go furtivley among the other women, invisible to all but his wife.
Putative son of John Tavernor."

My reading of this is that Ralph deserted Mary. She told everyone he was dead. she had a fling with John Tavenor and got pregnant, but rather than admit having an affair she tries to con everyone that hubby has been making secret visits!

What do you think?

But - if John TAvenor is the Dad, it brings my Edmonds line to an end. Or should I follow RAlph to carry on the Edmonds line - that doesnt seem right as James if James was not his son!

I hope in your case, that you find that that there are two Elizabeth Hemes, and so you can continue your line!

[Adrian Smith]

Hi Liz,

Thanks for the kind words - frustratin' ain't it!