Help with interpretation of a will

[jillruss]

I'm attaching an extract of a will made by a widow - Patience Henwood - in Hurst, Berkshire in 1728.

She leaves her estate to her daughter Patient Holt and son Robert Henwood, as well as her grandchildren by these two.

However, there is also a very intriguing bit which (if I've read it correctly) refers to a Mr Prince and makes a condition that they (Patience jun and Robert?) pay £5 out of their bequest to this Mr Prince for the burial of his mother Patience Henwood (i.e. the maker of the will!!) 'which is due to his mother' and then that he should return the £5 to his sister Patience Holt.

I deduce from this that Patience Henwood had a son (perhaps illegitimate?)named Mr Prince. I'd really welcome anyone else's input. Do you agree or have I got it completely wrong? And why on earth would she call him Mr Prince?

To add to my confusion, I can't find anything on the IGI to tie up the baptism of a Mr Prince to a mother called Patience and I'm afraid I can't find Patience's baptism either, so I don't know what her maiden name was - possibly Prince!!!

I'm confused!!    Please help!

Jill

[suey]

Hello Jill, I'm not convinced that says Mr Prince is there any way you can enlarge his name for a better look?

As for the rest, it does seem odd, why would they give him the fiver for the burial of their own mother only for him to return it?.

'that they pay five pounds out of it for the burial of Patient Henwood the mother of ? Prince which is due to his mother' - could there have been a Patience and a Patient, somehow related and she is just lending ? Prince the five pounds.

I'm probably barking but it's all I can think of 

Come on Rootschatters someone must have other ideas...

Suey

[Jane Masri]

Hi Jill,
Like Suey I'm not convinced that says Mr. Prince, although it does look like the name PRINCE.  Checked the IGI & the name does figure prominently in Berkshire.
 Found the daughters marriage, Patience Henwood to William HOULT 1/4/1714, Hurst.  I found children attributed to a  Robert Henwood & Patience:
Mary baptised 16/2/1692, Kingston Lisle, Berks.
Jonathan 12/2/1694                    ditto
Hannah  22/10/1699                   ditto

Patience junior & Robert junior might fit in there somewhere    If Patience junior married in 1714 I expect she was born around 1690's.  Perhaps her parents married early 1690's?  Worth asking for a look-up on the Berkshire boards for that to find her maiden name.
Also worth asking for a burial look-up for Patience Henwood in Hurst to see if it gives an age & one for a possible husband.
I'm not familiar with Berks so not sure if Kingston Lisle & Hurst are near each other

jane

[jillruss]

I've tried to make the extract bigger - not sure if I've succeeded. We shall see!!

Now you point it out, I'm not sure it says Mr Prince. Gadget has sent me a PM suggesting it says one prince - perhaps an old coin? but it definetly reads as if this Prince is a person!!

Jane -  the Patience who married William Holt in 1714 is the daughter mentioned in the will.

Your find of children to a Robert and Patience Henwood in Kingston Lisle is a new one to me. However, I looked it up on the map and it's in the furthest corner of Berks away from Hurst, about 30/40 miles. That's not to say they didn't come from there and it seems too much of a coincidence for it not to be Patience snr and her husband.

I've got the burial entry for Patience snr but, alas, no age given. There's a burial for a Robert Henwood in 1699 (no age) in Sparsholt, which is up near Kingston Lisle!!

You're right - I need to discover Patience snr's maiden name to try and solve the puzzle about Mr? Prince.

It doesn't get any easier, does it?   

Jill

[PrueM]

Hmmm....

I do think it's a capital M at the start, but the second letter is not an e.  Looks more like "Ml"  (that's Emm Ell) - could it be abbreviation ifor Michael or something?  Just a guess.

Patience senior calls her daughter Patient (at least in this will she does), so the relationship seems to be that Patient is the mother of Ml Prince, to whom Mary (Patient's sister) has to give a fiver in order to have his mother buried, and then he has to pay it back.

Hmmm....

Prue

[jillruss]

I know, Prue - mmmm, indeed!!

I was thinking along exactly the same lines - is Ml an abbreviation for Michael?

Why does Patient/ce snr talk about herself in the third person?!     My head's beginning to hurt!

I thought perhaps Patience snr and Michael (if, inddeed that is the name of her late husband) may have married and had their family in the Kingston Lisle area and then she moved to Hurst to be near her daughter Patience jun who had married a man from Hurst. However, does this make sense, as she obviously had land in Hurst to leave to her children and, anyway, there's no mention in her will of any of the 3 children baptised in Kingston Lisle to Robert and Patience Henwood - so did they all die in childhood?  Or is Kingston Lisle a complete red herring?

I think a plea for a look up on the Berkshire Board is called for - if only I knew where!   

Jill

[Gadget]

Still not sure about this, Jill. I've enlarged it and increased the contrast.

Gadget

[jillruss]

Thanks for that Gadget - and for your PM.

I still think it's a capital M - if you compare it to that in 'Mary' - but what comes next is a complete mystery - even after a couple of glasses of wine!!

I've posted a plea for look ups on the Berkshire board, but I'm a bit concerned that the complicated explanation might either put people off or make their heads spin!! We'll see!

Jill

[Gadget]

I haven't had any wine 

However - have you thought of Mc/Mac ?  Or even Wl (William)?

It does look like the other Ms though 

Gadget

Added - only things I can find as abbreviations are M'Lord, Miller or Much Loved!