John SUMJOO, circus artist

[bertoli22]

Hi
I'm having a hard time trying to find John and Elvina SUMJOO. 
In 1892 on their daughter Margaret's marriage cert John is recorded as being a circus artist.

I have been able to find three children of John and Elvina in BDM records and the IGI:

John SUMJOO: Born  bef. 28 May 1873 in Portsmouth Hampshire,died bef. Jul 1874 in Portsea, Hampshire

Jennie SUMJOO: died 1st Q 1900 Southampton, Hampshire aged 15

Margaret SUMJOO: m 1892 aged 18,  died 1909 St Pancras London aged 42

Margaret was living at 15 Castle Square Southampton at the time of her marriage.  Her mother Elvina was a witness at the wedding.

 In the 1901 census Margaret and husband (Thomas) John HUBBARD (textile dyer) and children were living in St Pancras, London. Both had died by 1909 and their daughters went to Egypt in 1908.

I have not been able to find any BDM or census records for John and Elvina SUMJOO.    They are believed to have been Indian though not sure.  Any ideas about where I might find something?

ciao Bertoli

[casalguidi]

Hi Bertoli

Given the surname, I think you probably need to consider spelling variations and mistranscriptions ie. use something like SOM*O or SUM*O when searching any available indexes.

Have you given any thought to the family living at 11 Broad Street, Southampton in the 1881 census RG11/1150 folio 4 page 3?

http://www.ancestry.co.uk

There is a birth registered Elvina Eliza SOMJOO in the March quarter 1871 which would probably fit with the 10 year old grandaughter ref. 2b 447 Portsea Island registration district.

Perhaps you need to bear in mind that the witness (Elvina) to Margaret's wedding may have been a sister or a mother?

There is a marriage Elvina BOXALL to (one of the two possible spouses) John SUMZAO in the March quarter 1870 Portsea Island registration district ref. 2b 576

What about the Eugenie SUMJOO born in the June quarter 1883 Portsea Island registration district ref. 2b 495 - would she fit in somewhere?  Age is a little out but I wonder if she could even be "Jennie"?  Can anybody find her or Elvi(n/r)a in 1891 or Elvi(n/r)a in 1901?

Why did the children end up in Egypt - did they have relatives there?

Casalguidi

[bertoli22]

Thanks casalguidi

I follow up those leads and get back to you.  How exciting

The daughters all went to Egypt to work as servants.  We're not sure why they specifically went there - they stayed with an Italian family in Alexandria and the eldest daughter Daisy married the boss when his first wife died.  i know a lot about the family that they stayed with and we haven't been able to find any connection.

Daisy eventually came to Australia following her children. 

thanks heaps, bertoli

[Dave Francis]

1881 Portsmouth (Town) Hampshire
Ref: RG 11/1150 folio 4 page 3

Address: 11 Broad Street
John Hall, head, mar, 70, chiropedist, N.K. India
Eliza do., wife, mar, 56, Birmingham Warwickshire
Elvinen SumToo, daur, wid, 22, Bristol Somersetshire
do. do., granddaughter, 10, Portsmouth Hampshire
Minev do., do., 5, do.

[Dave Francis]

1871 Portsmouth (Town) Hampshire
RG 10/1135 folio 115 page 29

Address: 126½, 127 High Street

Professor J Hall Boxall, head, mar, 50, chiropodist, India
[words struck through as shown]
Eliza do., wife, mar, 44, Warwick Birmingham
John SumJoo, son, mar, 22, gymnast, India
Roger Boxall, son, unm, 20, do., do.
Angelina Boxall, daur, mar, 23, dress maker, Portsmouth Hants
Eliza Hall, daur, mar, 18, actress, London Middlesex
<Elvinia?> Sumjoo, daur, mar, 17, do, Bristol Glo'ster
Nelly Boxall, grdaur, 2, Portsmouth Hants
<Elvinia?> Eliza Sumjoo, 2mo, Portsmouth

There are some complicated family relationships here!

[Dave Francis]

1891 Portsea (Town) Hampshire
RG 12/861 folio 77 page 24

Address: 2 Hawke Street
Eliza Hall, head, wid, 66, charwoman, Birmingham
Vina Sumjii, daur, wid, 35, machinist, Devon
Maggy do., grand daur, 15, nursemaid, Portsmouth Hants
Ujene do., do., 6, scholar, Portsea Hants

[casalguidi]

Brilliant stuff Dave

What an exciting family to research Bertoli!

Casalguidi

[bertoli22]

Thanks Dave and Casalguidi

Seeing all of the complicated links I don't feel so bad about having trouble finding them.  Thanks heaps Dave - great detective work.
You have given me heaps to go on with.
I will get a few certificates from the GRO.  I have a photo of Maggie and her husband John Hubbard - they  didn't look very well off.   I'll scan it when I get a chance and will post it so that you can see who you've been looking for.

I think that I need to get a large sheet of paper and try to map out where all of these people fit in.
I started out today not knowing much and now have heaps of leads - thank you both so much.  If you ever need anything looked up in Australia let me know.
ciao bertoli

[bertoli22]

Hi
No wonder I've had trouble finding these Sumjoos. How bad are these transcriptions

John Lemfor    =John SUMJOO
Phincebliga Lumfor =Elvina SUMJOO
Sawinea Sumjod    = Elvina SUMJOO
Panfesson Boxall = J Hall with Professor Boxall crossed out.

I think I need to change my family history subs 
ciao  bertoli