Author Topic: Rubber Ball!! What do I do next?  (Read 5031 times)

Offline jillruss

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Rubber Ball!! What do I do next?
« on: Tuesday 03 July 07 14:38 BST (UK) »
Do you remember that old song? 'Like a rubber ball, I'll come bouncing back to you'?

Well, that's me!

I started off with a Sedbergh marriage(by licence) on 22 Dec 1737 between Richard Troughton of Kendal and Jane Fridge, of Strickland Roger - this information was kindly looked up for me by a fellow Rootschatter some time ago. It's a couple of years after the Richard and Jane Troughton I'm looking for had their first child, but seemed to be a possible. My Richard and Jane lived in Fellside, Kendal.

About a week ago, I decided to follow up this lead so emailed the Cumbria Record Office. They referred me to the kendal Office. Another email , but I had a prompt reply telling me that they don't hold the marriage bonds for Sedbergh and referring me to Lancashire Record Office.

Fair enough, I emailed the Lancashire Office to be told that they had looked this up in the 'Lancashire marriage Bonds 1734 to 1738' published by the record Society of Lancashire and Cheshire but had failed to find the marriage in question.

What they did find were 2 marriages:-

1. 22 Dec 1737 Thomas Nuby, weaver and Jane Fridge of Strickland Roger, both 21 and both of the parish of Kendal. Bondsman James Collinson of Sedbergh, mason.
2. 29 Dec 1738 Richard Troughton of Long Moor Head and Isabel Beeby of Cattarin both of the parish of St Bees. Bondsman Robert Troughton of W'haven, mariner.

At first, I thought my RC contact had made an error and that the Troughton/Fridge marriage never happened, but she didn't seem the type to make such a fundamental error, so I emailed the Lancashire Record Office back to query this - and, guess what? - they referred me back to the Kendal Office as they hold the Sedbergh PRs!!

Another email (feeling like a bit of a nuisance by now!!). I've just received a reply from the Kendal Office, confirming that the Sedbergh PRs definetly have the Dec 22 1737 Richard Troughton/Jane Fridge marriage! There are apparently no marriages entered in Sedbergh between April 1738 and Jan 1739 so they couldn't comment on the 1738 marriage bond which Lancs told me about.

They have suggested that I might try the Bishops Transcripts ,but will have to contact the West Yorks Archives Service in Leeds!

Now, I don't blame any of the people I have contacted - they've all answered very quickly and very politely with the information that they held. It's not their fault that Sedbergh has changed county hands so often ( I appreciate the problems - I used to live in Humberside but now I'm back in east Yorkshire and I haven't moved an inch!!).

But wouldn't you think 'the powers that be' would try to arrange some kind of consistency in their respective Records Offices?

Anyway, rant over.. the problem is, I don't know what to do next! Any ideas? even if it ever took place, the Troughton/Fridge marriage may very well turn out not to be mine, but I'd like to try and find out which records are correct!

Phew!!   ::) :-\

Jill



HELP!!!

 BATHSHEBA BOOTHROYD bn c. 1802 W. Yorks.

Baptism nowhere to be found. Possibly in a nonconformist church near ALMONDBURY or HUDDERSFIELD.

Offline Mair

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Re: Rubber Ball!! What do I do next?
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 03 July 07 19:27 BST (UK) »
Jill

My first thought was BT's are a "copy" of the PR's.  In the mists of time - and my memory aint what is used to be - but bear with me, the parish register incumbent used to send a copy of his parish reg to his Bishop and they were transcribed - hence Bishop Transcripts.  Someone far better educated on that subject could enhance the understanding I am sure.

However, for all the faults of IGI I thought well lets give it a whirl - to put an overall perspective on the subject matter - so I did.  Here's what I found:-

The info you have been given is no doubt on if not is the marque......:-

I searched IGI for Jane Fridge 1737 +/- 5 years for England - no county.
I got:-
Jane Fridge  Female Marriage: 22 DEC 1737 Sedbergh, Yorkshire, England
Spouse Richard Troughton
Extracted marriage record for locality listed in the record. The source records are usually arranged chronologically by the marriage date.

So then I search for Richard Troughton 1737 +/- 5 yrs England no county...& got

RICHARD TROUGHTON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Marriage: 22 DEC 1737 Sedbergh, Yorkshire, England
SPOUSE  Jane Fridge
Extracted marriage record for locality listed in the record. The source records are usually arranged chronologically by the marriage date.

RICD TROWTON
- International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Marriage: 30 DEC 1738 Holy Trinity, Whitehaven, Cumberland, England 
SPOUSE  : ISAB BEEBY
Extracted marriage record for locality listed in the record. The source records are usually arranged chronologically by the marriage date.


Therefore there are two possibles here......and yes I searched for Thomas Nuby - the nearest result was for 1739 in Torver marr to an Elizabeth Jackson.

I know that I have not solved the problem - probably just added to it.  I might see if I cant ferret a bit harder on the problem at hand - but it will not be as good as seeing the records themselves.

Sorry, for just adding to the plot and not solving the mystery!  PR's are the best though I always thought........

M
Rowland/s- Hughes -Caernarfornshire/Stockport Cheshire
Barnicoat - Cornwall Lancashire Stockport,Cheshire
Jones (!) - Caernarvonshire,NWales  USA - Iowa, Wisconsin, S Dakota.
Thomas - Anglesey, USA Iowa, Oregon

Offline jillruss

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Re: Rubber Ball!! What do I do next?
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 03 July 07 20:12 BST (UK) »
The plot thickens!!

Mair, thanks for a bit of lateral thinking - it didn't occur to me to look for the 1738 Richard Trowton marriage on the IGI.

It looks to me as if whoever compiled the 'Lancashire Marriage Bonds' which the Lancashire Records Office appear to be using as their reference has muddled the two marriages together!  ???

I sort of feel that if I email them again, I'll get the 'fill in a form and pay for research' approach but - if they are the holders of the marriage bonds for Sedbergh at that time, then surely they should have their own index?

Thanks so much for your help - I'm going to send them another email pointing out what you've found (I'll be getting blacklisted!!) and I'll let you know what they say.

Jill
HELP!!!

 BATHSHEBA BOOTHROYD bn c. 1802 W. Yorks.

Baptism nowhere to be found. Possibly in a nonconformist church near ALMONDBURY or HUDDERSFIELD.

Offline Mair

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Re: Rubber Ball!! What do I do next?
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 04 July 07 10:12 BST (UK) »
Had chance to search again!

Marriage Bonds, Deaneries of Lonsdale Kendal Furness Copeland and Amounderness (Archdeaconry of Richmond), 1734-1738.
 Lancaster Marriage Bonds. 
Westmorland  England 
22 Dec 1737 Thomas Nuby, weaver and Jane Fridge of Strickland Roger, both 21 and both of p. Kendal. Bndsmn. James Collinson of town of Sedbergh, mason. At Sedbergh, Windermere or chapel of Grayrigg. Witn.Mark Rumney.

Marriage Bonds, Deaneries of Lonsdale Kendal Furness Copeland and Amounderness (Archdeaconry of Richmond), 1734-1738.
Lancaster Marriage Bonds.
Westmorland   England 
29 Dec Richard Troughton, of Long Moor Head and Isabel Beeby, of Cattarin, spr., both of p. St. Bees. Bndsmn.Robt. Troughton of W'haven, mariner. At p. church or New chapel in Whitehaven. Witn.Wm. Brisco. 

Here no result for Trowton! 
Some one somewhere has got wires crossed!  Hope you can straighten it out!

M
Rowland/s- Hughes -Caernarfornshire/Stockport Cheshire
Barnicoat - Cornwall Lancashire Stockport,Cheshire
Jones (!) - Caernarvonshire,NWales  USA - Iowa, Wisconsin, S Dakota.
Thomas - Anglesey, USA Iowa, Oregon


Offline bobgraham

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Re: Rubber Ball!! What do I do next?
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 04 July 07 11:25 BST (UK) »
If you put "bishops transcripts xxxxxxx" into your search bar or in google where xxxxxxx is the name of the parish, you may find them transcibed by SKS. And they are a lot easier to search electronically!!
bob
Cumberland: Graham and Greenop
Yorkshire: Altass
Scottish Isles: McLean

Offline jillruss

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Re: Rubber Ball!! What do I do next?
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 04 July 07 14:54 BST (UK) »
Thanks for the tip, Bob. No luck as yet, but I'll try again - I never was much good at googling!

Mair, I've emailed them again - still awaiting an answer. Definetly, the wires are crossed somewhere along the line with the PRs and the Marriage Bonds giving differing information.

I just hope they'll stick with it and sort it out for me. I have a sneaking suspicion that they won't want to know and will keep passing the buck to each other. I hope they prove me wrong.

Fingers crossed!
 :-\
Jill
HELP!!!

 BATHSHEBA BOOTHROYD bn c. 1802 W. Yorks.

Baptism nowhere to be found. Possibly in a nonconformist church near ALMONDBURY or HUDDERSFIELD.

Offline shelagh2

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Re: Rubber Ball!! What do I do next?
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 14 July 07 18:39 BST (UK) »
Hi,

Just happened across this post and wondered if there's anything I can look up again at Sedbergh for you please let me know. (I shall be going in about 3 to 4 weeks time) I can check if I was looking at transcripts, or originals. If transcripts I could see if there is someone at Sedbergh FHS who could help you. Or they have a web site where you may find someone to contact (see http://www.sedberghhistory.org/familyhistory.HTM)



Shelagh
Aberdeenshire and Banff - Benzie, Walker, Forsyth, McIntosh. Lancashire Chippendale, Parr, Houghton

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline shelagh2

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Re: Rubber Ball!! What do I do next?
« Reply #7 on: Saturday 14 July 07 18:43 BST (UK) »
Hi,

Just happened across this post and wondered if there's anything I can look up again at Sedbergh for you please let me know. (I shall be going in about 3 to 4 weeks time) I can check if I was looking at transcripts, or originals. If transcripts I could see if there is someone at Sedbergh FHS who could help you. Or they have a web site where you may find someone to contact (see http://www.sedberghhistory.org/familyhistory.HTM)



Shelagh
Aberdeenshire and Banff - Benzie, Walker, Forsyth, McIntosh. Lancashire Chippendale, Parr, Houghton

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline jillruss

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Re: Rubber Ball!! What do I do next?
« Reply #8 on: Saturday 14 July 07 18:57 BST (UK) »
Hi Shelagh,

It's a rum one, is this!

If I've got it right, the Sedbergh PRs are held at the Kendal Records office; the Sedbergh Bishops Transcripts are held at the West Yorks Archives Service in Leeds; the Sedbergh Marriage Licences & Bonds are held by the Lancashire Record Office (was Sedbergh ever in Lancashire!!)

You couldn't make it up, could you?!

Anyway, to be fair, the latest reply I had from the Lancashire Office is that the marriage bonds need to be sorted into alphabetical order and they are organising a volunteer to do just that - over 'the next few weeks' - and that they then hope to be able to solve the puzzle.  I hope so. Something has been mistranscribed somewhere along the line!

It's very nice of you to offer to take another look. To be honest, I'm not sure WHAT is actually held at the Sedbergh office, so any light you can throw on the problem would be greatly appreciated.

If I get a reply from the Lancs Office within the next couple of weeks, I'll let you know!  ::)

Jill
HELP!!!

 BATHSHEBA BOOTHROYD bn c. 1802 W. Yorks.

Baptism nowhere to be found. Possibly in a nonconformist church near ALMONDBURY or HUDDERSFIELD.