have census evidence but cant find birth

[JAP]

Hi xinia and Monica,

Thanks for great answers.

I just came back in to the computer thinking that I should explain why I commented on the various threads, and why I tried to give a summary.

I was going to say that it wasn't just being a grump about duplication (though of course I am!) but that:
1. I can't see things clearly in my own mind unless I have the whole story summarized in writing!
2. A summary sometimes brings out further information for the OP.

Monica, as always your reply and all the information you provide is fantastic!
*Ann, b Airdrie, in Dunfermline in 1851 is very convincing.
*Thanks for clarifying Ann b 1855 - presumably she did not survive.  Sorry I didn't find her - though I very rarely download info from SP re RC queries (too mean?  too sensible?).
*George & Janet (DICKSON?) in 1841 don't, as expected, add anything - surely a red herring.

So, some of the questions I posed (mainly from Monica's research) remain.

For example,
#(from Monica) what was Thomas FINNIE's occupation from Ann's DC
#the details of 1851 OPR marriage record of Robert SUTHERLAND and Ann FINNIE
#the occupation of Robert SUTHERLAND snr on the births/baptisms of his children with Mary SHORT
#possible (??) deaths of that Robert and his wife Mary in the SRs
#their son Robert (probably the Robert who m Ann FINNIE) in the 1841 census
#Ann FINNIE's parents and siblings in the 1841 census
#possible (??) deaths of Ann FINNIE's parents in the SRs
#Penelope SUTHERLAND's possible Poor Relief records

JAP

[Finley 1]

hello again,
bless you ur wonderful and all help is appreciated.... I will explain a little.... I am just a little bit over 60 so brain cells just a little inactive at times...(uhm what day is it?)
I have been doing this for my Pops who is 87  and bless him the remaining Sutherland on our side of his generation ...all his siblings and his wife...resting somewhere ....xxx
So due to the circumstances of his birth .... I wanted to re-assure him of his heritage.... because he is a wonderful father.

With now 7 years under my belt of sporadic research ...I was loosing heart ... but now with your help I am filling in queries, so far not certain of. 

So I will away awhile enjoy sunday lunch then come back to try and answer the questions you have ( ps I have shares in Scotlands People and Ancestry)
heres a copy of Anns Death cert for now. x

[JAP]

Dear xinia,

Well!  I'm not going to admit how old I am if a youngster like you is suggesting
that you have memory lapses!!

What a very sad death for poor Ann ...

I guess far too many of us have 'shares' in SP - even if not in Ancestry 

Looking forward to more info from you.

All the best,

JAP

[Finley 1]

RIGHT

RE-ASSESSED AND ON THE CASE!

Here is an interesting record....


Due to immense amount of information you all gave me.... I am slowly trying to take it all in and will get back to you with.. what I have when I can...

Thank you
Xinia

[JAP]

Hi again xinia,

Monica had found that baptism:

Monica also found a possible baptism for the Robert SUTHERLAND who married
Mary SHORT - 1796 in Glasgow, parents George SUTHERLAND & Penelope EDGAR (note
that Robert S & Mary SHORT named a daughter Penelope).

But it is interesting to see the actual entry in the parish register!  And to find that
George was a soldier.  This might lead to further information though I can't see
anything obvious in the UK National Archives (there are a few George SUTHERLAND
records but no mention of the 1st Regiment of Fencibles ...)

From the IGI, George SUTHERLAND & Penelope EDGAR were married 16 Jun 1787,
Saint Cuthberts, Edinburgh, Midlothian (do you have that extract?  I wonder if he
was a soldier at that stage?).
From the IGI, parents of those names had:
1788 Margaret in Saint Cuthberts, Edinburgh, Midlothian
1790 Janet in Inveraray & Glenaray, Argyllshire
1793 George in Glasgow, Lanarkshire (an LDS submission)
1796 Robert in Glasgow (an LDS member submission and has wrong month)
1799 James in Penninghame, Wigtownshire
1801 Henry in Gorbals, Lanarkshire

JAP
PS: I am interested to see the name MCLAWS in the extract and a strange
reference to 1829!  That name is of particular interest to me and I wonder whether
there is anything further about it in your extract ...

[JAP]

Some interesting sites about the Fencibles.

http://www.regiments.org/regiments/uk/lists/fen1793.htm

http://www.napoleon-series.org/military/organization/fencibles/c_fencibles.html

http://www.btinternet.com/~james.mckay/disp_014.htm

JAP

[Finley 1]

yes i have the marriage  -  will attach and it shows George as a Shoemaker -- which must have been previous to the Army.
The Army must have been the reason for the children been born in so many different places.

The Mclaw piece is at the very bottom of the extracted page ...so no more detail sorry ...will have a look next time I am on SP

thanks for the site adds to try  will enjoy later
Xinia

[JAP]

Hi again Xinia,

Thanks for the offer but please don't worry about the McLaws entry - I'll have a look
in my database and see whether I can identify what it might be.

How interesting that George was a shoemaker.  Incidentally, the second of the sites
I listed says:
"On 1 February, 1793 Great Britain was once again at war. The declaration of war
by the French Republic caught Great Britain at a disadvantage as it had both
disbanded most of the newly raised regular regiments of 1776-1783 after that
conflict had ended and reduced its own peacetime establishment to practically nil.[1]
While it immediately took steps to recruit its regular regiments for general service, it
also established a regular force of Fencible Regiments, for home service only, to
augment the Embodied  militia of the Kingdom. This force was especially necessary in
Scotland, which had no large militia force of its own until 1798"

Re the marriage of George SUTHERLAND & Penelope EDGAR, putting Penelope's
name first in an IGI search brings up the additional piece of information that her
father was George.
Tempting to think she's the following:
Penn EDGAR b 11 April 1766, St Cuthberts, Edinburgh, Midlothian, daughter of George EDGAR & Janet DUNCAN.
George & Janet were married 1761 St Cuthberts and had (all St Cuthberts) Robert 1762,
John 1764, Penn 1766, Peter 1768, George 1770, Alison 1772, Ann 1777 and Hugh 1779.

JAP

[Finley 1]

Yes Jap,
Downloaded that one and hopefully it is correct...
Now on the hunt for previous generations...
It is unusual thought that so far I havent come across any of the MIDDLE names of the children of Robt and Ann....Dunn....Hunter....Morris....However I am looking at a William and MaryEdinburgh for possible parents of this George...
Xinia