Marriage John PENROSE - Philippa POLGLASE

[maidmarianoops]

1841 census breage
lots of polglase family
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~dtrounce/Breage_P.html

OOPS

[brissygal]

Thanks everyone for your help.   

I'll list what I already have, to save duplication 

Stephen Bastian married Elizabeth Gilbert 6 May 1783 Breage. Stephen died before 1841 census.

Stephen & Elizabeth's children, all christened Germoe:
Ann 14 Jan 1798
Thomas 20 Nov 1785, d16 Sep 1786
Margaret 5 Jun 1795
Gabriel 29 Mar 1801, d 17 Apr 1801

Ann Bastian married John Polglase 17 Apr 1822 at Germoe. Ann signed name. John signed X.Photocopy of parish register. Estimate John born 1792-1795. No details of parents or siblings.

1841 Census, Trewethin Common, Germoe, Kerrier-Cornwall (FreeCEN printout and printout of scan of original)
Polglase:
John, M, 45, Copper Miner, b Cornwall.
Ann, F, 40, b Cornwall
James, M, 15, b Cornwall
Elizabeth, F, 15, b Cornwall
John, M, 15, b Cornwall
Ann, F, 13, b Cornwall
Stephen, M, 7, b Cornwall - (Stephen Bastian Polglase)
William, M, 4, b Cornwall
Phillipa, Female, 10m, b Cornwall
Bastian, Elizabeth, F, 80, b Cornwall (Ann's mother)
(Earlier Phillipa born/christened 3 Feb 1833, died an infant.)

1851 Census, Centenary Row, Camborne (I have print of scan of original)
Polglase:
John, Head, Unmarried, 25, Copper Miner, b Germoe
Elizabeth, Sister, Unmarried, 27,     , b Germoe
William, Brother, Unmarried, 14, Copper Miner, b Germoe
Phillipa, Sister, Unmarried, 10, Scholar, b Germoe
William Taylor, Lodger, Unmarried, 14, Copper Miner, b Cornwall, Unreadable
(Family split up - have parents died?)

1861 Census, Centenary St, Camborne, St Martins, Redruth-Cornwall(Printout of Free-Cen & printout of scan of original)
Roberts -
Joseph, Head, Married, M, 33, Miner, Constantine
Elizth, Wife, Married, F, 34, b Germoe (Philippa's sister)
John P, Son, Unmarried, M, 5, b Camborne (John Polglase Roberts)
Catherine Ann, Dau, Unmarried, F, 3, b Camborne
Joseph, Son, Unmarried, M, 2, born Camborne (Joseph died in mining accident. Son was Joseph Bastian Roberts.)
Philippa, Dau, Unmarried, F, 1m, b Camborne
Polglase, Philippa, Boardr, Unmarried, Female, 20, Miliner, b Germoe

Now to Lancashire.
1871 Census, Dalton, Lancashire - relying on Elizabeth Roberts' decendent, who confirmed 1861 entry, and gave me 1871 census link.  Philip A Paleflase - She is with the Roberts family again. The gt ... grandaughter got this from the Ancestry.com transcript. View of original shows Philip A should be Philipa, and Paleflase is actually Polglase. This is recent contact, don't have full details yet. My contact's line is through the Joseph and Joseph Bastian Roberts.

Now to Wales.
1881 Census, 69 Upper Pentre, Eysttl St, St John near Swansea, Glamorgan. Photocopy of microfische.
Penrose:
John, Head, Married, M, 50, b Cornwall
Philippa, Wife, Married, F, 35, b Cornwall
Charles E, Son, M, 4, b Swansea, Glamorgan Charles Edwin)
Frederick G, Son, M, 1, b Swansea, Glamorgan (Frederick George, my grandfather)

(1881 Census, 24 Low Fell Croft, Dalton in Furness, Lancashire - Joseph Roberts 54, Iron Ore Mine, Elizabeth Roberts 55, Joseph 22 Iron Ore Mine, Francis P 20 dressmaker, Edith 16 dressmaker assist)

1891 Census, 28 Park Road, Tredeager, West Monmouthshire - printout of scan of original.
Penrose:
John, Head, Married, 64, Confectioner, b Cornwall
Phillippa, Wife, Married, 45,b Cornwall
Charles, Son, 14, Baker, b Swansea
Fred, Son, 11, Scholar, b Pontypridd (should be Swansea)
Joseph, Son, 9, Scholar, b Swansea (should be Pontypridd)
Richard, Son, 6, Scholar, b Cardiff

1901 Census, 24 Moira St, St Mary, All Saints, Cardiff, Glamorganshire   I have printout from www.census.pro.gov.uk, Ancestry.co.uk, and of scan of original
Penrose:
John, Head, Married, 78, M, Confectioner, b Truro
Phillippa, Wife, Married, 56, F, b St German
Fredk, Son, Single, 21, M, Baker, b Swansea
Richard, Son, Single, 16, M, Messenger Boy, b Cardiff

1901 Census, Gable Cottages, Manorbier St James, Pembrokeshire   www.census.pro.gov.uk & Ancestry.com.uk
Charles E Penrose, Head, Married, 23, M, Baptist Minister, b Swansea
Emma (Anna?) Penrose, Wife, Married, 27, F, b Plympton Devon
(census.pro says Emma, Ancestry.com says Anna)

John Penrose was born somewhere in Truro, Cornwall. He died and was buried Jan-Mar 1902 in Cardiff, aged 77.

Philippa Polglase was born 21 Jul 1840 in Boscreage, Germoe, Cornwall. (Cousin has birth certificate.) Christened 21 Aug 1843 at Breage. (printout of scan of original.) Philippa Penrose died 20 Feb 1924 in Cardiff - birthday book owned by Charles' wife. Yet supposedly she was buried 13 Feb 1924 in Whitchurch, Cardiff. 

Children:
Charles Edwin, Apr-Jun 1877, Swansea
Frederick George, 17 Jan 1880, Swansea
Joseph Henry, Jan-March 1882, Pontypridd
Richard Thomas, 6 Feb 1855, Cardiff

John & Philippa's ages are inconsistent in censuses. And often vague about their place of birth. Not helpful.

Need to find John before 1881.

I had become very fond of my 'other' John and his family.  I'm beginning to 'grieve' for their loss already as I had begun to feel I 'knew' them.

Have you noticed HOW MANY John Penroses there are in Cornwall? 

You are all wonderful people.  I am truly grateful for your willingness to help me, and amazed at your generosity.   

Thank you.
Brissygal   

[deb usa]

Hi everyone

Just had to get my rootschat " fix "  before packing and heading out this afternoon

Hiya Kris.... Yesterday was father's day .... had to keep away from computer and do the father's day 'thing' LOL

I have also had another look around for John the confectioner in 1871 and 1861...to no avail.

I have reread the post several times and just saw something that we should possibly check. Brissygal says that family stories have it that Philippa, the teacher, ran off with a travelling minstral    ...maybe we should be looking for John Penrose under a different occupation prior to 1881.

Deb

[toni*]

i have found two possible death for John Polglase (Phillipas father)
if he did indeed die between the 1841 & 1851 census

all Helston area which covers Germoe

Q2 1844 9 81
Q4 1848 9 69

and for Ann (Phillipas mother)

Helston again

Q4 1843 Ann Polglass 9 70
Q3 1845 Ann Polglaze 9 68

[brissygal]

Thanks, Toni*.    I'll keep them in mind. Hard to tell without purchasing death certificates, and even then do they contain necessary detail? Can be very frustrating, but addictive.
Brissygal   

[toni*]

yes i know what you mean but if someone has access to burial records for Cornwall they could possibly look them up to see if the age tallies. 


Toni

PS on a different subject i thought i had a Mary Penrose in my family and followed her line back to 1728/1732 only to find my great great grandfathers immigration / emigration records and his mother was recorded as Mary Johns! - no John Penroses though


 

[deb usa]

Hi

Was trying to find out what happened to the rest of the family by 1851...

I found these two possible  deaths:

POLGLASE
Stephen Sept 1843 Helston vol 9 pg 69
William   Sept 1843 Helston vol 9 pg 67

Toni has found a possible death of the mother ,Ann POLGLASS - Dec Q 1843...

Wonder if they was an epidemic going on ....

deb

[brissygal]

Hi Deb
Do death certificates always show cause of death back then?
Hey - thought you were going on Hols. LOL. Going anywhere exciting? 
It's 11.15pm here - gotta get some shut-eye or I'll never get to work tomorrow.
Brissygal 

[maidmarianoops]

1871 census philippa was sister in law to the roberts
sylvia
dalton lancs district 8