Which Mary Mary Ann(e) (Annie) Shepheard is mine ??

[cogvos]

Dear all,

I'm stuck, I mean really stuck on this. 

Mary Ann(e) Shepheard (or Shapard or Shepard etc) married George Wooster on 25 December 1883 (never knew people could marry on Christmas day!) In the Parish Church of Pinner Middx.

I'm trying to find out where she was born and I'm stuck.

According to her marriage she was 20 in 1883 and her father was one Thomas Shepheard, Labourer. Problems start however when I look at subsequent census returns;

In 1891 the family is in Gretta Road, Pinner. Marry ann is now Annie, age 27 and her birthplace is 'Unknown' they have 4 Children, George Henry, Charles James, Ada and William Charles. (George's father was a Charles)

In 1901 they are in Headstone and Mary Anne is still Annie, age 38 but born in 'Bucks'. The family has grown (although they may have lost Charles) with George H, Ernest I,  Ada H (who is actually Ada Ellen), William C, Albert E, Alice A, Violet M and Beatrice.

If I take Annie's age as correct (always a bit dodgy) then she was born around 1863. The IGI suggests the following;

Mary ann 07 SEP 1862       Saint Paul, Chatham, Kent, England - Thomas and Eliza
Mary        17 JUL 1864       St Peter'S, Chester, Cheshire, England - Thomas & Catherine Walker Shep
Mary        21 AUG 1865       St Chad'S, Rochdale, Lancashire, England - Thomas & Jane

Mary Ann Eliza 14 JUN 1863       Saint John The Baptist, Shoreditch, London, England Thomas & Elenor
Mary Ann Frances 11 OCT 1863       Tong, Shropshire, England Thomas and Lucy Shipard (which of course could be a transcription error)

None are in Bucks, but given the first census of 1891 I guess that's not surprising.

Free BMD suggests 2 possibles in Bucks in 1862-
Mary ann Shephard Brackley 3b 1
Mary ann Sheppard Newprot P 3a 470

And a massive list (around 100) elsewhere. Ugh.

Has anyone got any suggestions how I can find which Mary Ann Sheppard (or combination) is mine? I have tried free reg but without much clue as to the county I'm very stuck, and since people often moved to a parish to get married I don't think that the register will help. She is living in Pinner Drive, the same as George at the time of her marriage.

J.

[toni*]

lots of my realtives married xmas day, i thought it was a family tradition until it was pointed out that it was actually free to marry xmas day!

anyway what we need to do is to find Mary Ann Shepherd age 17/18 with father Thomas in 1881

[mosiefish]

Hi,

Don`t know if this helps:

1881 census

11 Pinner Drive, Pinner

Thos. Sheppard, Head, Mar, 49, Farm Labourer, Berwick
Mary, Wife, 34, Berwick
Amy, Daur, U, 16, D Servant, Berks Slough
Ann, Daur, 13, D. Servant, Berks Slough
Martha, Daur, 9, Scholar, Middx Stanmore
Henry, Son, 5, Scholar, Harrow Middx
George, Son, 2, Harrow Middx

I will have a look for them on the 1871 cenus.

Regards,
Mo

[welsh lady]

I think Mo has found them i think the 1901 birthplace could be Berks not Bucks if you have a look again

Welsh Lady

[cogvos]

Dear All,

Many thanks for this, unfortunately I also found a family at 24 Nelson Road, Harrow (just up the road from Pinner), also Thomas with an Ann as a 7 year old child and a Mary as a wife  . Mind you the 11 Pinner drive sounds more likely. I can't separate them in any other way (both Thomas' are labourers, farm and brick ). It seems v unlikely that one family of shepheards would move out only for another to move into the same road! Then again 

Looks like my problem is that I assumed that she would be registered as a Mary or Mary Ann, yet she is not. At least this explains why she is Annie once she gets married!

Although Ancestry have opened up their indexing for a free look (1881 only) they haven't opened the original image so I cannot confirm the location, other than to say that Slough is in Berks. Looks like a trip to Aylesbury is needed to see what Ann/ Mary Ann was christened as. The IGI can't help as I have no idea what batch number slough is under and you can't just enter the surname and year (why???).

J.

<EDIT!>
Just got my thinking head on  If she's 7 in 1881 that'd make her 10 in 1883 so scratch the stuff I typed about the Harrow Family. Mind you the 11 Pinner Drive one would only be 16 and not 20 when she was married. Then the first child was born on the 4th March 1884...

[Necromancer]

Use this IGI 'front-end' to go to County and parish ....

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~hughwallis/

[mosiefish]

Hi,

Just a point - the Ann at 24 Nelson Road was only 7 years old on the 1881 census! The same family in the 1871 census just had the three boys Robert, George and male Shepherd at 3 weeks old.  HOWEVER, just out of interest on the same page in 1871 is a Mary A Shepherd, 11?, Visitor born Harrow  in the house of a James Davis and family.

1861 the above Thomas and Mary do have a daughter Mary A aged 1.  It is possible that she was the "visitor" in the 1871 as her mother had just had another child.  This doesn`t help as the age is incorrect but thought you should know.

The 1891 has the same family still living at 24 Nelson Road.
Regards,
Mo

[cogvos]

Hi Mo,

Yes I goofed on the age of the Harrow Ann. My edit and your post must have crossed. Sadly I don't have full access to Ancestry so can't have a look at the  the Mary A as the visitor till I get somewhere that does.

I confess that I am a tad confused at present, could you confirm that I have this correct?

In 1861 Thomas and Mary Shepheard, have a daughter, Mary A age 1 and live at 24 Nelson Road
In 1871 a Mary A Shepheard is visiting James Davis aged 11 and the Nelson Road family have a new son
In 1881 the Nelson Road family have a daughter Ann Age 7.

In 1881 The Pinner Drive family have a daughter Ann age 13.

I wonder if the 1881 entry for Ann in Nelson road is a mistake and it should be 17?

[mosiefish]

Hi,

Yes I can confirm that is how it looks.  I am blowed if I can find the Pinner Drive family in 1871  arghh!  Believe me I have tried for some time now. 

These are the census entries for the Nelson Road Shepherds:
1861
London ??. Harrow
Thomas Shepherd, Head, M, 29, Gardener, Oxford Hardwick
Mary, Wife, 28, Harrow
Mary Ann, Daur, 1, Harrow

1871:
Northolt Road, Harrow

James Davis, Head M, 32, Lab, Northolt
Julia, Wife, M, 32, Laudress from Home, Harrow
John Son, 23, Scholar, Harrow
James, Son, 10, Scholar, Harrow
Ellen  ?, 80, Lodger, Hendon
MARY A SHEPHERD, Visitor, 11, Scholar, Harrow

4 doors away

Thomas Shepherd, Head, M, 38, Bricklayers Lab, Oxfordshire Standlake
Mary, Wife, M, 37, Harrow
Robert, Son, 9, Scholar, Harrow
George, Son, 5, Scholar Harrow
? (Blank) Shepherd, Son, 3 weeks, Harrow

1881 living at 24 Nelson Road

1891
24 Nelson Road, Harrow

Thomas Shepherd, Head, M, 59. Stonemasons Labourer, Hardwicke Oxf.
Mary, Wife, M, 58, Harrow
Edward, Son, S, 20, Post Office Clerk, Harrow
Harold, Son, 14, Telegram Messenger, Harrow

Will have another stab at the Pinner Road ones for 1871.

Regards,
Mo