A mystery first marriage: 1830s-1850s

[AndrewMartin]

Hello,

I've been stuck for some time now with the mystery identity of my Gt Gt Gt Grandfather's first wife.

My GGGGrandfather's name was James Martin, born about 1815 in Witcham, Cambridgeshire.

In 1850 he married his second wife - Mary Tingey (b.1821, Little Downham). Both have widower/widow on the certificate and so i've been trying to find a suitable marriage for James between the mid 1830s and 1850.

I know it wasnt Susan Loakes of Witcham (married a James Martin in 1842) as she appears with another James (born about the same year!) on the 1851 census...

...but otherwise, i'm stuck and i've run dry of the online and paper resources.

If you can help or suggest a source.. then please do so! I'd be very grateful.

 

[suffolk*sue]

From Boyds marriage index


1833 / MARTIN  JAMES / BARKER  ELIZABETH / SOHAM 



1834/  MARTIN  JAS/  BENTON  AN  /PAPWORTH ST AGNES 


1836/  MARTIN  JAS / TITMOUSE  SARA/  GUILDEN MORDEN 

[AndrewMartin]

hi Sue, thanks for these.

Im pretty sure that i can rule out Papworth and Guiden Morden.

Soham might stand a chance but i recognise the coupling - i'll check my records.

[Frances]

Hi Andrew,

This is from the BVRI

James Martin and Mary Ann Moxon 7 June 1841 Downham
Husbands Father Robert Martin
Wifes father John Moxon
FHL Film 1040460   

Frances

[AndrewMartin]

hi Frances, thanks for suggesting that one but unfortunately that doesn't fit either 

Here's a bit more info:

James Martin (bc 1814, d.1868) was the son of James Martin and Mary Waters of Coveney.

James Martin (Jnr) married widow Mary Crisp (nee Tingey) on 27th July 1850 at The Countess of Huntingdon's Chapel, Oxlode, Cambridgeshire. Their certificate reveals that BOTH had lost their previous spouse.

Now, I don't know whether the venue of this second marriage might be a clue - someone once told me that it also served as a pumping station (or something like that!), meaning that the records are somewhere different? Unfortunately, with this being the darkest fenland, I guess it does mean that Coveney, March, Mepal, Little Downham, Ely, Littleport and Witcham could all be candidates... but unless the marriage register was completed incorrectly (?!!), this first Martin marriage remains a mystery so far 

Thanks everyone for your interest and help so far 

[bedfordshire boy]

I'm not convinced you're not mixing and matching different James Martins

In 1851 James Martin 37 born Coveney  and his wife Susanna 29 born Bluntisham Hunts and four children were living in Wardyhill, Coveney.

Next door was James Martin and wife Mary both 67, he born Coveney, she at Mepal.

Cambs FHS Baptism Index shows James Martin baptised 1814, son of James and Mary, abode Wadrow Hill.  Wadrow Hill/Wardyhill??? So this looks to be the one still living in Coveney in 1851 married to Susanna, so he's not your ancestor. But you say your James was born in Witcham, as was Susan. The only Susan Martin born Witcham that I can see was the wife of William Martin of Coveney.

The question is who was your James Martin? I think you need to go back to basics.

Do you have him in any census to use as a starting point, and we'll see if we can go backwards from there.

James was your 3xg grandfather. Who was your 2xg grandparent, child of James?

David

[AndrewMartin]

hi David,
Thanks for that. It is quite confusing as there are more than one JAMES MARTIN born at roughly the same time in that area.

William and Susan Martin of Wardy Hill and James and Susan(nah) of Coveney are not the right branches as they have not produced the 1851 James Martin, come the 1861 census. Plus, I have the 1851 birth certificate for James Martin which shows the identity of his parents.

My Gt Grandfather was Herbert Martin, b.1884 in Downham Fen. His parents (my Gt Gt Grandparents) were James Martin (b.10.05.1851, d.02.05.1934) and Sarah Elizabeth Giddings (b.03.07.1852, d.1925).

On James Martin's birth certificate in 1851, his mother is named as "Mary Martin, formerly Tingey" and his father is James Martin.

Here's the census instances that i have so far:

1851, Little Downham
Mary Martin, H M 29, Ag Lab's wife, b.Lt Downham
William Crisp, S U 4, - , b. Lt Downham
Sarah Saddons, Si M 19, Rail Lab's Wife, b. Lt Downham
John Saddons, Ne U 8mths, - , b. Lt Downham

James Martin (Mary's husband and my gt gt gt grandfather) is missing!

Elsewhere in Lt Downham/Oxlode is a 32yr old James Martin but he's married to Judith and with a massive family. In Wimbotsham (?), Norfolk is a 38yr old James Martin, married, Ag Lab.. but not with his wife. He is living with his brother-in-law (a name i have never seen before)... and James' place of birth has been left blank. I have no idea where he went in 1851 - the year of his son (my gt gt grfthr)'s birth!


1861, Little Downham
James Martin, 46, Railroad Lab, (my gt gt gt grandfather)
Mary Martin, 41
William Crisp Martin, 14, b. Lt Downham
James Martin, 9, b. Lt. Downham (my gt gt grandfather)
Ellen Martin, 7, b. Lt. Downham
Sarah Martin, 5, b. Lt. Downham

1871, Little Downham
Mary Martin, H, W, 49, Gatekeeper, b. Lt Downham
James Martin, S, U, 19, Ag. Lab, b. Lt Downham (my gt gt grandfather)

1881, Little Downham
James Martin, 29, Railway Lab, b.Oxlode (100ft Bank)
Sarah Elizabeth Martin, 28, -, b.March
Isaac Martin, 6, - , b. Downham Fen
Rose Martin, 5,-,b. Downham Fen
Walter Martin, 3,-, b. Downham Fen
William Martin, 1, -, b. Downham Fen.

1891, Little Downham
James Martin, H M 39, Railway Watchman, b. Lt Downham (gt gt gfthr)
Sarah E Martin, W M 33, -, b. March
Rose Ellen Martin, D U 15, Domestic Servant, b. Lt Downham
Walter James Martin, S U 13, Scholar, b. Lt Downham
George E Martin, S U 9, Scholar, b. Lt Downham
Herbert Martin, S U 6, Scholar, b. Lt Downham (my Gt Grandfather)
Emma Jane Martin, D U 3, - , b.Lt Downham

1901, Little Downham
James Martin H M 49, Railway Platelayer, b. Lt Downham
Sarah Martin W M 48, - , b. March
Walter Martin S U 23, Ag Lab, b. Lt Downham
Herbert Martin S U 16, Horse man on farm, b. Lt Downham (gt gfthr)
Emma Martin D U 13, - , b. Lt Downham
Percy Martin S U 9, -, b. Lt Downham
Ethel Martin D U 6, -, b. Lt Downham
Albert Martin S U 1, -, b. Lt Downham

[suffolk*sue]

Any idea where James was in 1841, maybe with his first wife and possible children then.

[bedfordshire boy]

Hi Andrew

I've just been looking at your tree and trying to pick up the family in censuses, concentrating on 1861. In it James gives his birthplace as Downham and age 46. As he was described as a rail road labourer,  he was possibly away from home building railroads in 1851 - was an occupation quoted on his marriage cert? But there's a James Martin married 35 ag lab birthplace unknown living in Wicken in 1851 which is not far from Downham, which might be him.

I think the James son of James and Mary baptised 1814 at Coveney, abode Wadrow Hill, is the same James age 37 born Coveney married to Susanna living at Wardyhill in 1851 next door to James and Mary Martin. Which if correct blows the pre 1814 part of your tree out of the water. James and Susanna's 1842 marriage cert should help prove/disprove my theory.

What was the name of James' father on his marriage cert to Mary Tingey - James I assume?

As he married in a nonconformist church it's possible he wasn't baptised in the established church

Must dash and cook something for my little one - he's starving

I'll carry on after lunch

David