Carliol Square/Sweeney

[peter brownlee]

The 1901 census at 29 Middle St Elswick, gives Dora Liddell born Newcastle 1900
Father Thomas M Liddell 33 Inspector at Shell Gun Works born Harperley Mills Durham.
Mother Annie 19 born Newcastle.
The shell gun works would be Armstrong Whitworth at that time, only afew hundred metres away from Middle St across the railway line.
Harperley Mills are on the River Wear in rural upper Weardale near Wolsingham, but Thomas's family were already living in Newcastle by 1871 when he was aged 3.
The 1871 census at No 5 Rye Hill Elswick, gives his father as Joseph Liddell 29 Agricultural Agent born Kyo farm Durham, and his mother Margaret 27 born Stanley farm Durham.

[percy porter]

So you feel that the 'Newcastle' Dora Liddell is the one I am looking for and we can discount the other two?

It's the move from "Inspector" in 1901 to "Wireworker"in 1917 that makes me query this one. A change of job or a sideways promotion?

If the adress of Weatherly Street was the family residence, is it close to the gun works?

[peter brownlee]

I thought the heavy artillery connection favoured Thomas M's Dora. Rye hill and Park Rd are above average addresses for Elswick so Thomas's father must have been succesful as an Agricultural Supply Agent, but disaster was never far away in Victorian times. I didn't find Thomas in 1891 but his mother was recently widowed with a large family and keeping a grocery shop. Middle St where Dora was born would only be worker's housing.
I am more used to Victorian connections when girls married men their families knew. If Gunner Sweeney had joined for war service only could he have been a worker at Armstrong Whitworth alongside her father?
I identified the wrong Harperley by the way> There are two in Co Durham> The one where Thomas M was born is on a hilltop just outside the mining town of Stanley which his mother gave as her birthplace and across the fields from Kyo where his father was born 

[peter brownlee]

I have located Weatherley St, making a corner with Middle St where Dora lived. On my  old map marked as W'erley St, but such a minor feature it doesn't appear in the index.
In the 1901 census one of the neighbors in Middle St is described as Machine man at the Shell gun works. Wasn't Dora's groom so described. Her father Thomas M has a scrawled supplement to his description which looks like Steel Fire,  though if the F were turned 90 degrees it would be a W.
I noticed a Martin Sweeney not far away in Hawse St, Elswick with a son called John B, but of course it is not an uncommon name, there had been a lot of Irish immigration into the Durham coalfield in the previous generation.
Hope this all comes together for you, Peter

[percy porter]

Thanks Peter, yes you are right he was described as "Gunner Royal Garrison Artillery, Machine Man" I always believed that the latter was possibly his civilian occupation. That's another firm lead to follow, I'll get back to it later this morning, SWMBO has a specialist appointment today she fell UP the stairs at work on Saturday and has a possible fracture in her wrist/finger.

[percy porter]

The plot thickens, it turns out that Dora Liddell had older siblings.
Lilian, Thomas and Jack. Alaso Helen who was born later and to the best of my knowledge is still with us and living in BC Canada.

Back to the drawing board!
 

[peter brownlee]

Thins would be a more accurate word. If that is a family recollection then we must have been following entirely the wrong line. Probably the West Hartlepool one instead.