Boswell Help Please!!

[manga]

I have been researching my family tree, and noticed a Boswell relation, a Mary Ann Boswell, she was a convict who came to Australia 1832 she was tried in Southwark, and was a native of Kennington (Lambeth) Surrey, her father if I am right was an Edward Boswell, and mother Elizabeth Heffer, she was born 1813, and Baptised St Marys Kennington. Would be interested in knowing of any link to Gypsy Boswell family.
Thanks

[cathayb]

contact romany roser on here.she knows alot about the aussie convicts.

[cathayb]

DESPERATELY SEEKING...
My query concerns one Lucretia Smith given as aged 74 and Matilda Boswell. believed to be her daughter aged 40  - ages given on their tombstone in 1844.  Lucretia was given as Queen of the Gypsies.  They are buried in the churchyard of St Mary the Virgin in Beighton, formerly in Derbyshire but now incorporated into the City of Sheffield.  They are reputed to have lived in the village but do not appear on the 1841 census.

[richarde1979]

Cathayb

I'm currently researching the Boswells for a book. I don't have them on the 1841 census but have an idea at least on who they might be. The claim that they were mother and daughter doesn't appear in the parish register entry for the burials, or on the gravestone. It comes sixty five years later in the 1909 book of gravestone monuments 'Epitaphia' and I think is either the author drawing his own conclusion from the stone or reporting stories that had grown up in the village. I don't think too much store can be put on those, as Lucretia is also supposed to haunt the graveyard!

I think they were actually niece and aunt, though possibly if Matilda was in a relationship with one of her cousins, Lucretia may have been mother in law too. Neither died at Beighton, Matilda died in Lythe, Yorkshire, 110 miles away and Lucretia at Halton, Cheshire, 70 miles away, so both were transported some distance to be buried there, why I'm not sure.

These are Lucretia's children:

Hannah Smith, daughter of Josiah Smith and Lucretia, baptised at Cadeby, Leicestershire on 21st December 1802.

Phenix Smith, son of Josiah Smith and Lucretia, baptised at Thurnby, Leicestershire on 3rd August 1806

Josiah Smith, son of Josiah Smith and Lucretia, baptised at Saltby, Leicestershire on 2nd April 1809.

Senah Smith, daughter of Josiah Smith and Lucretia, baptised at Market Overton, Rutland, on 9th May 1811.

Jenny daughter of Josiah Smith 'Gipsy' and Lucretia , no settled abode,  baptised at Long Stratton, Norfolk on 27th March 1814.

Rhoda Smith, daughter of Josiah Smith 'tinker' and Lucretia Gipsies no settled abode, born 4th November, baptised at Baytham, Suffolk 17th November 1816.

Sarah Smith, daughter of Josiah Smith and Lucretia, baptised at Monks Kirby, Warwickshire on 6th February 1820.

These make it unlikely the age on her burial is correct. I think she is actually Lucy Boswell, daughter of Robert Boswell and Lucy, baptised 20th December 1780 at Thornage, Norfolk. Robert Boswell was born circa 1735 in Wiltshire and buried at Loders, Dorset in January 1806 (according to Frances Hindes Groomes 1880 book In Gipsy Tents a monument was put up there on his grave to the 'King of the Gypsies'). Robert's wife appears on all other records as Lucretia/Lucresey and they had been together since about 1760. He was polygamous and had taken on a second, much younger partner, Mary/Ann around 1776 and travelled with both women. In January of the same year Lucy/Lucretia was baptised, Mary/Ann baptised a son with Robert, Edward Boswell at  Kilmington, Somerset, he was Matilda's father and was also buried as a 'King of the Gypsies' in the 1850's in Devon.

[richarde1979]

Edward Boswell and Phyllis Lee, married by license at St Mary, Hanwell, Middlesex on 14th October 1799.

Matilda Bosell [sic] daughter of Edward Bosell and Phillis, baptised at Hawkhurst, Kent on 21st September 1800.

Edward Boswell, son of Edward Boswell and Phyllis, baptised at Yeovil, Somerset, on 16th April 1802.

Messali Bosswell, ‘born in Kent’ daughter of Edward Boswell and Phillis, ‘Travellers encamped at Fryen Hill Wood’, was baptised at Otterbourne, Hampshire on 18th September 1804. (On alternate transcriptions given as Merreli )

Louisa Bossell [sic], daughter of Edward Bossell and Phillis, baptised at East Stratton, Hampshire on 27th April 1806.

Delia Boswell, daughter of Edward Boswell and Phillis, of Kilmington, Somerset, baptised at Paignton, Devon on 5th February 1808.

Phillis Boswell, 12 days old, daughter of Edward Boswell and Phillis, baptised at Kilmington, Somerset on 8th February 1812.

Eliza Boswell, daughter of Edward Boswell and Phillis, baptised at Duddington, Northamptonshire on 21st December 1813.

Noah Boswell, son of Edward Boswell and Phillis, baptised at Walthamstow, Essex on 4th June 1815.

Caroline Boswell, daughter of Edward Boswell 'Vagrant' and Phillis, baptised at Lyme Regis, Dorset on 24th August 1817.


The above is Matilda Boswell's baptism with her siblings. This means her age is also slightly out on the gravestone. But I do think it is her because of the following newspaper report:

Wednesday, 27 March  1844 DERBYSHIRE LENT ASSIZES – Wednesday, March 20 – Noah BOSWELL, 24, and Joseph SMITH, 28, (gypsies), charged with having on the 6th day of March instant, at the parish of Beighton, stolen a promissory note of the Chesterfield and High Peak Bank, for the sum of 5/-, four sovereigns, and two half sovereigns, the property of Thomas MIRFIN. SMITH was found Guilty, and BOSWELL acquitted. Sentence on SMITH, 7 years’ transportation.

This is only a couple of months after Matilda's burial at the same place. I think this is Matilda Boswell's brother Noah with his cousin, Lucretia's son Josiah/Joseph. Again the ages are out, Noah would actually be 29 and Josiah 35, but I can't see any other Noah it could be.

[richarde1979]

The following report of Lucretia's inquest appeared in a newspaper five days before her burial, which also gives some info on her last movements:

Liverpool Mercury 22nd November 1844. Warrington. Inquest on a Gipsy - A lengthened investigation took place on Monday last, at lower Walton, before William Caldwell Esq. the coroner touching the death of Lucretia Smith, a Gipsy, about 70 years of age,which occurred on Thursday in a Shippon [i.e cattle shed] belonging to Mr James Swinton of Lower Walton. The deceased, it appeared, had been apprehended in Montgomeryshire, by a Police Officer, named Ady, charged with being one of a party of Gipsies who had deluded a Cheshire farmer out of sixty pounds under the pretense they they would 'rule his planets' for him, and recover the possession of some stolen articles. She was taken to Shrewsbury, and there dismissed, on account of the non-appearance of the prosecutor. She was again apprehended at Warrington, bought before the magistrates on the 18th instance, and discharged, the simple farmer not being able to identify her as one of the party. The old woman and her daughter were on the way to join their friends and had reached Walton, where she fell ill and died on Thursday morning. The result of the inquiry was a verdict that the deceased had died from natural causes, and that Ady was free from blame.

[cathayb]

thank you very very much.the knowledge is wanted by a lady that lives by the graveyard and folk are always enquiring of her the story behind these two woman.as she talks alot to the tourists she wanted to be able to inforn them so this will help her conderably.thank you again and when the book come out could you please let me know as i would love to buy a copy.i have a tree of boswells that were round hampshire and witlshire and also they got upto a bit of smuggling.if i can give you their details if you dont already have them i will let you have the onfo.we also have some notorious boswells in cornwall that i can give you some info on if you want it.thanks again for your help.cathayb

[richarde1979]

No problem at all Cathayb happy it is of help. The book I'm working on covers the Boswells from 1650-1810. I decided to cut off after that point, because the book is already quite large two parts about 175 pages each, and there is a lot of info on the later periods already out there. I'm hoping the RTFHS will publish it when finished. I have a section for burials which does cover Boswells buried in the 19th century who were born before 1800, which is why I have looked into Lucretia's grave, as I am about 80-90% sure she is the same person as Lucy/Lucretia Boswell born 1780. Her father Robert and his wives were fairly long travellers, I have records of them travelling large distances in England, though they seem to have settled around the southern counties as he got older. His father, and Lucretia's grandfather, was probably the Henry Boswell buried at Ickleford, Hertfordshire in 1780, (another down in the local lore as a 'King of the Gypsies') but can't prove that for certain.

As for smugglers I would be interested in your information. I have come across a couple of records from the 18th century of Romany Stanleys, on the south coast involved in smuggling, but not for Boswells. I have come across a couple of Romany Boswells down as inkeepers in areas, such as Lancashire, on the shipping coasts, where otherwise they never travelled. This has led me to wonder about smuggling as Old Will Faa had an inn at Kirk Yetholm in the same era, and was definitely heavily involved in the smuggling there. I think from memory either him or his son received a blow to the hand from a cutlass escaping the customs men, and cried out that they had ruined a fine fiddler for life!

[Patricia Blacklaws]

I'm not sure if anyone has made a "leap" to South Africa on the Boswell "quest"?? They are a 3rd generation circus family (that is as far as I have been informed) ~ it just seems to me to be interesting that this seems to hold similarities when making comparisons?!

Kind regards
Patricia