TREASE/TRAIES continued...

[cdaikoff]

Thanks for your help, I'll be sure to follow up on the Runnalls.

Mary Trayes

1851 Census Canada West Northumberland County District Hamilton surname written Ronalds
1861 Census Canada West Northumberland County District Hamilton surname Runnalls
1871 Census Canada Ontario Northumberland West Haldimand surname Runnalls
1881 Census Canada Ontario Northumberland West Haldimand surname Reynolds
1887 death July 1 Haldimand

her children

Elizabeth 1835 b St.Breward
Jane 1838 b St. Breward
John 1841 b St. Breward d Cobourg 11 Feb 1899 informant George Lumley
William 1845 b WC (Canada West) d 1918
Ellen 1846 b Cobourg Canada West m Joseph McMurray (my 2nd grgndfather) 18 Oct 1870 Grafton Ont.
                  her marriage records lists John and Mary Reynolds as parents, witnesses are Mary Jane
                  McMurray (Joseph's sister or sister in law) and Thomas Bell (Joseph's brothers Arthur and
                  James marry Bell sisters Elizabeth and Mary Jane) d 24 December 1906 Haldimand Township
Ann 1848 b WC m Erastus Barrett 11 July 1873 witnesses Ester Eddy, (Joseph McMurray's sister Ellen
                  marries Eli Eddy), Frederick Runnalls - she is listed as Annie, d 22 March 1937 name on
                  death record and headstone is Mary Ann parents John Runnalls, Mary Trays  informant
                  daughter Mrs. D Church
Frederick 1851 b WC
Matilda 1855 b Cobourg Canada West m Thomas Coffey 10 July 1889 residence listed as Vernonville
                    (the McMurrays settled in Vernonville) witness Matilda Lumley - Matilda's daughter Mary
                     marries Gordon McDonald the brother of Ellen's son Frederick's wife - great grandpa Fred's
                     cousin married his brother in law - boatload of names tying families together on that
                     record)
Lucinda 1858 b WC 20 May, m Peter Louks of Vernonville Dec 1999 (when she was 41), married in
                      Brighton Township of Hamilton, d 23 January 1937 Dorset, Haliburton parents listed as
                      John Runnalls Mary Trays informant neice DW Church, burial Paint Lake Cemetery
 
Mary is buried in St. George's Anglican Church Cemetery in Grafton (along Lake Ontario, just east of Cobourg, west of Colborne and Brighton, south of Vernonville). It is one of the oldest monuments in the cemetery and is directly behind the church. The headstone is for John Runnalls and wife Mary. Beside this monument is one for her sons John and William and beside that Thomas Coffey and Matilda.

I have found the information for Ellen's siblings incidentally as I researched her. I will now go back and see what else I can find - perhaps it will lead to some Runnalls/Hoskins clues.

Looking through the Trease website has helped me tremendously. It has given me incite on how I might look for information in other sources (besides census, birth, death records), pay more attention to witnesses, informants and such and track related and neighbor families more thoroughly. (Although finding Eddys, McMurrays and Broomfields living side by side for 4 decades and intermarrying had me thinking along those lines I particularly liked reading the reasoning/proofs for assumptions - I'm going to start listing the same in my notes. I find when I go back I often forget why I listed what I did and where I got the proofs and have to take the time to search my notes and line it all back up again before I go forward.
 
I have photos of the monuments in St. George's Cemetery, but don't know how to share them here.
I will start a Runnalls thread now that I know a little more about how to navigate here.

Thanks again for all your help. I hope I have helped to fill a small space in your research. We are all very proud here to have roots in Cornwall and have a connection to the Trayes family.

[gardenerbob]

Thank you for all your help in identifying what became of Mary. I've added it to the website. Pleased to have also been of some help to you. You are right about Cornwall - I think it the most characterful part of Southern England. Wish you every luck with your future research.

Kind regards, Bob

[gardenerbob]

For anyone interested in the Samuel TRAIES & Wilmet BOWDEN families I have updated that part of the TRAIES tree and filled in most but not all of the gaps. Still can't match Deb at filling in the gaps. This part of the tree includes the artist William TRAIES. I found another artist  - his granddaughter, daughter of his daughter Maria RUDGE who seems to have married in Mauritius or somewhere strange where records are difficult to access.
William's father worked for a local Crediton builder John RAWL who kept a diary which makes many references to "TRAISE" including where he worked on what days and how much he paid him - amazing what material is available to us family historians. The updated tree is on this link
http://www.trease.org.uk/traies/txt/txt16s_wb.htm

PS Tried to sort out the early Crediton TRAIES family tree. It is possibly clearer than it was but it is still confusing and unfortunately wrong. I have ended up with burials of John & Sarah TRAIES but haven't got any TRAIES's left to whom to attribute them.

Hope everyone is keeping well. For me, it is that time of year when gardening beckons.

Regards,

Bob

[deb usa]

Hi Bob

Haven't been here for a while but as usual found my way back to the Traies family.

I have been wandering around your site for hours haha ... and Came to the same conclusions you did re: Samuel T who married Wilmot Bawden. That baptism of 1726 where Sam is s/o Sam and Sarah could be incorrect as there doesn't seem to be any others being born to that couple..... OR was there another married Samuel in Crediton at the same time?

Anyway I wanted to know who John Traies b 1762 living in Crediton belongs to? On IGI they have him as s/o William and Mary.  In 1841 he is transcribed as John Traces, 79, shoemaker living with Elizabeth A Traies 72. Both born in county.
BTW there is also a William "Traces" b 1794 also living on the same street ...High Street. His age is hard to read ...to me it looks like he's 77 so bc 1764.

Could John (1762) possibly be the son of William (s/o Samuel and Elizabeth Creese) who was mentioned in the Will but no baptism has been found.

OR is John b 1762 s/o William and Mary Bond OR s/o John Traies (m1760 Mary Porter) who became a shoemaker in Soho, London.

Well I've certainly entertained myself this afternoon   

Best regards
Deb

[gardenerbob]

Dear Deb,

Its great to have your input on this brain numbing family tree. I will get back to you with a more detailed reply but for a start .. I got so stuck on this that I went back and transcribed some of the early Crediton parish registers with different results from what I had from other sources. I had a go at putting my findings on the website at this location : -[url]http://www.trease.org.uk/trr/trr_dev.htm#c_cre/url]

Interestingly I could not find a 1760 baptism that matched the one I had from early researchers of a John Traies s/o William & Mary  born 14Sep1760 baptised 12Nov1760. This purported to be copied from a Devon & Cornwall record society (DCRS) transcript. I can't believe they would make a mistake and concluded that the entry had been mistranscribed by the early Trease researcher. The entry I found was clearly for a John Traies s/o Samuel & Wilmet baptised 01Oct1760. Also none of the entries I transcribed had birth dates.

Similarly I inspected the William Traces 1841 census return. He is almost certainly the William TRAIES mason whose Will refers to the block of houses burnt down that he rebuilt and the persons living adjacent to him match the names of the persons living in his rented out rebuilt houses.  I have put details of this on the website at this location
[url]http://www.trease.org.uk/traies/txt/txt16s_wb.htm#17w_mh/url]

I am puzzled why I have not confirmed the IGI entries for 1762 when I reinspected the Crediton parish registers and will get back to you with some more observations on this and other matters later. Strangely I found a new puzzling entry re a John Traies shoemaker in Rochdale yesterday and also that John s/o William b 1724 in St Luke, Chelsea enlisted in the army in Manchester another puzzle, and both up North a bit.

Bob

[gardenerbob]

Dear Deb,

I think the 1762 baptism of John s/o William & Mary is correct. I can’t inspect the parish register images on-line any longer but believe I ticked the IGI transcript on my list when I found it on the register but did not bother with checking/correcting any spelling differences. I reckon he is the son of William and Mary BOND. John married Elizabeth KERSLAKE and the KERSLAKE family feature in a Codicil to the Will of William TRAIES m. Mary BOND & d.1812. Link : -

http://www.trease.org.uk/traies/txb/txb17w_mb_will.htm

I think I had a “senior moment” when I sent my reply yesterday. Anyway, the son of William born 1724 St Luke was James not John. He appears on this link: -
http://www.trease.org.uk/traies/txt/txt17s_ec.htm

The other record to which I referred was : -
1850   c. 10Mar1850 Rochdale. James Thomas TRAIES s/o John & Betty TRAIES, Shoemaker  (ANC img)
I think he is related to the Crediton family but can’t see how at the moment,  maybe one of them went "up North" and disappears off the current trees.

There are two burials that I can’t fit into the Traies Crediton tree are : -
1781   i. 3Jun1781    Sarah TRAIES       (DCRS, FindMyPast img x 2)
1782   i. 29Dec1782    John TRAIES       (DCRS)
If they are husband and wife, maybe John is s/o Samuel & Elizabeth c. 1718 (who has no burial record associated with him) and the John who married Sarah Ellacott in 1754 (who similarly has no death record associated with her). The drawback is that William Traies’s 1770 will has the succession as William s/o Samuel and then Samuel s/o Samuel and makes no mention of John.  If John & Sarah had no surviving children and Sarah could produce no more children this may account for why William omitted him from the Will entirely. I have not listed this possibility on the website - can’t think why - might simply have overlooked it.

Kind regards,

Bob.

[deb usa]

Ho Bob,

I'm trying to get a grip on all of these people.

So William b 1763, mason is s/o Samuel and Wilmot Bawden and
John b 1762 is s/o William and Mary Bond

Are the father's Samuel and William related?

added ....  I can't find the record of James Thomas Traies s/o John and Betty. What year was he born?

Deb

[gardenerbob]

Dear Deb,

Samuel married Wilmot Bawden in 1749 and was the son of Samuel who married Elizabeth Creese in 1717.

William married Mary Bond in 1759 and was the son of John who married Sarah Pidlar in 1724.
His father John was the brother of Samuel who married Elizabeth Creese in 1717.

So the fathers Samuel and William were related as first cousins.

The James Thomas TRAIES appears on Free BMD:
b. TRAVIS James Thomas (Rochdale RD Jul-Aug-Sep 1850 V21 p740)
in which case his parents' marriage appears to be: -
m. John TRAVIS & Betty COCKROFT (Rochdale RD Oct-Nov-Dec 1842 V21 p466)
The baptismal entry was indexed TRAIES on Ancestry and I inspected the original handwritten entry. Most of the Manchester area entries indexed TRAIES  on Ancestry appeared to be TRAVIS on inspection but I thought this one was TRAIES - I am going to have to look at it again - it looks like another transcription error - in which case apologies for wasting time.

I’ll get back on this when I have investigated it more thoroughly.

Bob.

[slightlyfoxed]

researching Joan Pomeroy daughter of Roger of Sandridge
lI was looking at Elias Wills father of Roger's wifes Joan
You dont have her mother' s Joan Dawbyn BM

Simple search OLPC/Cornwall
Baptism  20 June 1591 Landrake - Joane daughter of Nicolas DAWBYN
Marriage 1 Joan Dawbyn on 14-Feb 1614  at St Germans, to  William BODY- no children found in Cornwall

Marriage 2 Elias Wills Esq to Johanna BODY on  2 Jul 1616 at Parish St Stephens by Saltash
8 children
Marriage 3 Thomas Wyvell  by Exeter Cathedral licence (FindMyPast) 15 Dec 1627