12th July and Orange Lodges - Help offered

[beresford]

hi 
 
i have been trying to find info on both my father and grandfather who were both members of the Orange Lodge

i have a very old photo of my grandfather with his lodge but there is no info a to which one and i have a medal that belonged to my father which i'm not sure has anything to do with the Lodge or football as on the back it says 1st Div 1925-26 and then his name -  have been told my father used to carry the flag in the parades

both of them had the same name Thomad Alexander Beresford my grandfather dies in 1949 and my father in 1980 the family came from Belfast and lived in Syden St west  for most of their lives and they were a large family 13 altogether

any help at all - even just an address to contact would be great

many thanks

[liscoole]

Hi fmni

Would you have any information on a William John Lynn, member of a portadown lodge, born c 1872?

Also a Thomas McIvor- 1884- 1922 member of North Belfast Temperance lodge I think.

thanks so much
liscoole

[gail34]

Hi
 Would it be possible to find any information on John
(Jack) Sommmerville born in Scotland John was in the Orange Order when he died 1936 Newry sorry but this is all I
that I know John was my gr uncle and any information woul be grateful
               Many thanks
                        Gail

[fmni]

Apologies for not replying to this post in a while.

Unfortunately for the above posters it will be difficult to track down the information on your relatives without contact with the individual private lodges - only one lodge is stated and that lodge title no longer exists - there is a lodge called 'North Belfast' (LOL 2046) but no 'North Belfast Temperance' - within Clifton Street Dist No. 1 (which would cover North Belfast, there are plenty of 'Temperance lodges' - perhaps one that might fit the build is, "North End Temperance" (LOL 1252)

I am compiling an 'interested names' database now and will add the following to it:

John/Jack Sommerville d.1936 b.scotland member of the order in Newry
William John Lynn b.1872 member of a lodge in Portadown
Thomas McIvor 1884-1922 possible member of North Belfast Temperance lodge
Thomas Alexander Beresford d.1949 from Syden St area, Belfast
Thomas Alexander Beresford d.1980 from Syden St area, Belfast
James Wilson b.8/5/1866, livied at McClure Rd and Conlon St, Belfast, emi. England


also with regards to 'Beresford' post. 1st Div 1925-26 does not relate to the Orange Order. This is almost certainly a sporting medal. It might be worth investigating whether any of your relatives played for Belfast Celtic - they won the football 1st division in that particular season. It is unlikely that it is a rugby or cricket medal as they didn't have overlapping seasons - rugby wise in both 1925 and 1926 Instonians won the Ulster Senior League.

[fmni]

For future reference as well - the lodge number is often the key to tracking relatives down. If you have old pictures or even an old collarette or sash, their lodge number will be on it. Feel free to post photos here and I'll see what can be deciphered!

[liscoole]

Many thanks for your reply

Liscoole

[noseyoap]

thank you for reply - mine was just a longshot, I really question whether he was a member at all.  This is a bit of a cheek but I notice you are searching for ancestors in Lambeg, the named Henry Longmore Chapman was born in Lambeg. I am trying to find his baptism but the Church at Lambeg said they have no records there for 1845 and Proni say the records are at the church!! Have you been able to find the records anywhere? I have come against a brick wall
Pat

[Kate Cunningham]

Hi fmni,

Found this thread through a Google search for "Orange Lodge"....hope you may be able to help me with a couple of questions.

1. Would you have any information on LOL Creve 101 near Newry Co.Down? My husband, who lived in Benagh until he was 12, was a junior member of this lodge and remembers carrying the flag in the parade.

2. Also as part of my general search for information I came across a web site that mentions that there are membership registers for 1893-2000 held by the Grand Oranage Lodge, Belfast. Do you know if these are available for the public to view or would you need to ask for permission?

There is an sample page to view at

http://www.data-archive.ac.uk/doc/4435/mrdoc/pdf/source.pdf

I'm hoping that if I can access these membership records it will show other family members i.e. Grandfather, Great Grandfather etc.

Many thanks for the offer of help.

Cheers,

Kate Cunningham
Wellington NZ

[fmni]

Hi fmni,

Found this thread through a Google search for "Orange Lodge"....hope you may be able to help me with a couple of questions.

1. Would you have any information on LOL Creve 101 near Newry Co.Down? My husband, who lived in Benagh until he was 12, was a junior member of this lodge and remembers carrying the flag in the parade.

2. Also as part of my general search for information I came across a web site that mentions that there are membership registers for 1893-2000 held by the Grand Oranage Lodge, Belfast. Do you know if these are available for the public to view or would you need to ask for permission?

There is an sample page to view at

http://www.data-archive.ac.uk/doc/4435/mrdoc/pdf/source.pdf

I'm hoping that if I can access these membership records it will show other family members i.e. Grandfather, Great Grandfather etc.

Many thanks for the offer of help.

Cheers,

Kate Cunningham
Wellington NZ

Hi Kate,

I'll try and answer both your queries...

1) Creve LOL 101 doesn't exist although that's not to say it hasn't in the past. It is unlikely though as the lodge number 101 is part of Loughgall District rather than Newry District and has the lodge title "Clantilew Bible and Crown Defenders"

Within Newry District though there are 12 lodges including a Creve/Crieve lodge (Crieve Purple Star LOL 252) and also a Benagh lodge LOL 302. I don't have anything on these individual lodges but certainly if I come across anything in the future I will let you know. I don't know the history of the Royal Black Perceptory or Masons in the area, perhaps they had a lodge number 101?

2) Regarding those books mentioned in Eric Kaufmann's studies - these books aren't 'registers' as such but more of a minute book. Within those books lodge numbers will be recorded rather than individual names e.g. LOL 252 - 55 members. It won't list all 55 members names. The names you see on that page will be those recorded as either suspended, expelled or holding District Office (and in some cases Worshipful Masters or Secretary's of Private Lodges)

Unfortunately no central registers are kept - it is hoped that in the future names will be collated as best as possible from various sources such as private lodge books, district and county books and then digitised however this is a long way off yet and will rely heavily on funding etc. The process of training archivists etc has begun though so we're at least making inroads in the right direction.

Regarding the County minute books - these are not publicly available but are held in a library based at the Grand Orange Lodge of Ireland. There is sensitivity over data that names living members or living former members of the Institution - whilst permission may be given to view records pre-dating the 1920s/30s it is unlikely that more recent books will be accessed by the general public, and unfortunately certainly not copied. As I said though, it's a tad mis-leading on Kaufmann's part to indicate the records kept are 'membership registers' although he does say on his research website that...

"Please note: this study does not include information on named individuals and would therefore not be useful for personal family history research."


Hope this answers your queries - sorry I can't be of more help at this stage!