Ideas on the ethnicity of my grandfather?

[Nick29]

This is a fascinating thread - I have to say that the top photo is very reminiscent of Charlie Chaplin - not just because of the little mustache and the hat.  His clothes look quite smart at first glance, but closer inspection reveals them to be quite poor quality, and probably altered to fit.  Chaplin came from a very poor background too.

[LizzieW]

I agree with the Eastern European theory.  That was my first thought when I saw the photo.  That's not to say that he wasn't an orphan from Ireland though.  His father could have been a sailor who got friendly with an Irish lady

Lizzie

[Sloe Gin]

He had Dupuytren's contracture, which is more commonly a European (particularly Scandinavian) condition. 

Just to say that a connection of my family had this, and he was Irish, but I have no idea if it is particularly prevalent in Ireland

[oldcrone]

Thanks for these further suggestions/thoughts - I appreciate them. 

Yes, Nick29, you are so right about the poor quality of my grandfather's clothing: I ?reckon this photo was taken just after WW1 (which he survived as a soldier in the trenches).  I'm fairly certain that his wife and children were living in a workhouse while he was fighting in WW1, and continued to do so after he returned.  Eventually, he earned enough money for them all to be reunited in a rented house in Leatherhead.

For clarification: the first official bit of info I have on my grandfather is in 1900; it's London, and he's enlisting with the 1st Battalion, Leinster Regiment.  He says on his enlistment papers that his name is James Aloysius Smith, that his next of kin are his older brothers David and John, address unknown.  On later official documents (his marriage certificates), he gives his father's name as Henry Arthur Smith, farmer, deceased; and Henry Arthur Shaw, farmer, deceased.

He had a Canadian passport in the '50s; but having checked out the Canadian Passport site, it would appear that they don't keep records of 'old' passport applications, and also that there were no stringent checks for people applying for passports prior to 1950 (ie my grandfather could have applied for a passport without providing verification - but this still begs the question: if he wasn't actually a Canadian citizen, then why apply for a Canadian passport? ie what's in it for him to be a Canadian, if he actually wasn't one?)

[MKG]

I'm not entirely sure on this, but I think that prior to the end of WW1, he simply wouldn't have needed a passport at all. Perhaps the Canadian one became necessary for travel later. And isn't it true that possession of a valid passport establishes a legal nationality?

Mike

[Nick29]

Oldcrone, it sounds like your grandfather had to "live on his wits".  It wasn't uncommon for poorer people to "moonlight" (i.e. rent a place, then leave before the landlord collected the rent), and if you owed money to people in those days, it wasn't a bad idea to have a few different names to go by.  I'd be more inclined to believe what he told his children, rather than what he told the army, so being born in Ireland and sent to Canada is more likely.  There were lots of potato crop failures in Ireland between 1850 and 1880, so he may have been sent to Canada as the result of those.

[Redroger]

Passports were not compulsory before WW1, probably the end of the war and the tightening of regulations made him apply for a passport, and he happened to be in Canada at the time.

[Redroger]

Forgot to add; I understand that people with black hair and blue eyes from Cornwall and Western Ireland are believed by some to be the descendents of survivors from the Spanish Armada whose ships were wrecked off those coasts.

[jds1949]

Just to add another possiblility to this quest - Aloysius was quite often used as a Confirmation name by Catholic boys in the late 19th - early 20th century and is usually associated with being educated by the Jesuits - Saint Aloysius being one of their leading lights. This was most common in the North West of England and parts of Ireland.

jds1949