Help with Latin Please

[sunnylew]

Hi,
I was wondering if anyone could help with the following Latin:

Rob'tus Bockenham filius cuisdam Thome Bockenham qui quid Tho. . . . furti damnatus fuit Norwici loco executionis ibm collo suspensus, et quaed Margareta uxor sua baptizat fuit 9 die mensis septembris Ano ut supra.

It is from a parish register, and I'm not sure whether it was Robert who was, I think, hanged, and his son Thomas by Margaret baptised, or vice versa - or maybe his wife Margaret was baptised very late?

Any help would be much appreciated.

[pinot]

I understand it to mean that Robert son of Thomas, found guilty of theft, was hanged, and that his wife Margaret was baptised. Was she the mother of another Thomas? The gap might provide more.
                       Pinot 
                               

[sunnylew]

Thanks Pinot.

I thought itwas his wife being baptised as well (though I thought it was Thomas's wife).

My latin is so bad, I didn't believe that it could be an adult (and already married) baptism. I trust your translation far more than my own attempts 

Unfortunately that gap is there in my "source" - a transcript of a parish register. I have no reason to believe they're even related to me, so I will leave it at that unless my curiosity gets the better of me.

[Roger in Sussex]

Hi,

From the endings of the words I think it is Robert who was baptised and Thomas who was hanged.

Not quite sure what it says about Margaret - could the ending of her name possibly be e or ae rather than a? If so that would indicate that she was Robert's mother.

Hope that helps. Off to do some gardening now, will look back again later

Roger

[sunnylew]

Definitely Margareta.

I forgot to put in an apostrophe after the first quid - i.e. it was quid'. I'm not sure if that could change the reading, it being a contraction.

Does anyone else have any opinion of who was the son of whom?

The reference is from:

http://openlibrary.org/details/gentlemansmagazi21gommuoft/leaf42

the right page just below half way.

From my use of online Latin translation programs "filius cuisdam" seems to mean "son of whom", or does it mean "of whom's son"?

[pinot]

Robert Bockenham, son of a certain Thomas . . . (cuiusdam = of a certain); hard to tell whether it was Robert or Thomas who was hanged. I believe that the bit about Margaret is a separate sentence: she was Robert's wife, I believe, and it is her baptism, I think, that is recorded.
                    Pinot

[Roger in Sussex]

Hi Sunnylew and Pinot

It seems that the Gentleman's Magazine may have misquoted this entry. See quote from snippet view from Google books.

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=zCgIAAAAQAAJ&q=%22Thome+Bockenham%22&dq=%22Thome+Bockenham%22&pgis=1

If this version is correct, and et should be ex, then I think it follows that Margaret was Robert's mother and Thomas' wife. It seems possible that this is correct, as uxore would agree with Margareta and sua (ablative, not nominative , to be pedantic)

The only way to be sure would be to look at the original, if it has survived.

Roger

[pinot]

Hi Roger,
            Very enterprising of you to have found the Google snippet! Agree with all your conclusions; a good lesson in the need for a little scepticism when using secondary sources.
                                  Pinot

[Roger in Sussex]

Hi Pinot,

Thanks for your kind words

I suppose it is possible that different people have in the past made their own interpretations of a difficult original, and expanded abbreviations according to their own interpretations?

Roger