Author Topic: Paupers, public and mass graves.  (Read 18548 times)

Offline elin

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Paupers, public and mass graves.
« on: Saturday 23 May 09 18:21 BST (UK) »
Can anyone tell me what the difference between these burials is?
I've had a good look online and just ended up more uncertain. ???

Elin
Foxwell (Wotton Under Edge and South Wales), Howell (Stroud & Wotton Under Edge), Jones (South Wales) Merrigan (Liverpool), Kelly (Liverpool) Titley (Lincolnshire and Staffordshire)  Hellier (Somerset and Monmouthshire)           All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline robbo43

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Re: Paupers, public and mass graves.
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 23 May 09 21:12 BST (UK) »
My understanding, and I may be wrong, is that pauper graves were where the family was unable to pay for a funeral  or there was no-one to pay, the funeral was minimal, paid for by the parish/poor law union and the grave was re-used.  Public graves were where the family were able to pay for a funeral but not purchase a grave plot and the plot was used for a number of unrelated burials, five or six in the example I have come across.  Mass graves are usually the result of natural disaster/military action/etc where a large number of bodies have to be buried at once - dig a large hole and throw them all in

Robert
FLOOD - Exeter, Middlesex.  DAVEY - Norfolk, Herts, West Ham.  MILLS - Hampshire.  GARLAND - Sussex.  BRIGHT - Hampshire, GULLIVER - Hampshire, Sussex, London.  NOCKELS - Norfolk.  POMEROY - Exeter.  RANDALL - Sussex, Surrey.  REYNOLDS - Cambridgeshire.  BOWYER - Cambridgeshire & Suffolk.  STUPPELL - Kent.  MISSEN - Cambridgeshire.  TAYLOR - Cambridgeshire.  TOWNSEND - London.  CURTIN - London, GIBBONS - Suffolk, BROWN - Suffolk, SWALE(S) - Yorkshire, GAIN - Sussex

Offline elin

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Re: Paupers, public and mass graves.
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 23 May 09 21:59 BST (UK) »
Hi Robert,

Thank you very much, that would make sense. 

Elin
Foxwell (Wotton Under Edge and South Wales), Howell (Stroud & Wotton Under Edge), Jones (South Wales) Merrigan (Liverpool), Kelly (Liverpool) Titley (Lincolnshire and Staffordshire)  Hellier (Somerset and Monmouthshire)           All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Plummiegirl

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Re: Paupers, public and mass graves.
« Reply #3 on: Friday 22 January 10 21:20 GMT (UK) »
Paupers Graves were used, until the creation of local/municipal councils & cemetaries, for people who could not afford to be buried by their family - the names of people within these graves will be in the record books for the cemetary.
Public Graves are what paupers graves were subsequently called after local/municipal councils took over.
Mass Graves are usually the result of tragedies or war.  In some war arenas when massacres happen the opposing side just dumped bodies in mass graves.
A "mass grave" in a cemetary or "mass row" (such as at Aberfan in Wales) are often the result of an accident.

Under the front part of Kennington Park (Sth London) there is a mass grave from WW2 where an airraid shelter was bombed & is now a flower garden/memorial to those who died here, I do not think all the names of those who died are known.
 
Fleming (Bristol) Fowler/Brain (Battersea/Bristol)    Simpson (Fulham/Clapham)  Harrison (W.London, Fulham, Clapham)  Earl & Butler  (Dublin,New Ross: Ireland)  Humphrey (All over mainly London) Hill (Reigate, Bletchingly, Redhill: Surrey)
Sell (Herts/Essex/W. London)


Offline elin

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Re: Paupers, public and mass graves.
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 23 January 10 10:44 GMT (UK) »
Thank you Plummiegirl!  :)

I had forgotten this post but it it as relevant for me now as when I posted it.
That is a really clear and helpful explanation, I was particulary confused about paupers and public graves.   

Thanks again,

Elin

Foxwell (Wotton Under Edge and South Wales), Howell (Stroud & Wotton Under Edge), Jones (South Wales) Merrigan (Liverpool), Kelly (Liverpool) Titley (Lincolnshire and Staffordshire)  Hellier (Somerset and Monmouthshire)           All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline coombs

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Re: Paupers, public and mass graves.
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 03 February 10 21:45 GMT (UK) »
Many of my London ancestors were buried in public graves.
Researching:

LONDON, Coombs, Roberts, Auber, Helsdon, Fradine, Morin, Goodacre
DORSET Coombs, Munday
NORFOLK Helsdon, Riches, Harbord, Budery
KENT Roberts, Goodacre
SUSSEX Walder, Boniface, Dinnage, Standen, Lee, Botten, Wickham, Jupp
SUFFOLK Titshall, Frost, Fairweather, Mayhew, Archer, Eade, Scarfe
DURHAM Stewart, Musgrave, Wilson, Forster
SCOTLAND Stewart in Selkirk
USA Musgrave, Saix
ESSEX Cornwell, Stock, Quilter, Lawrence, Whale, Clift
OXON Edgington, Smith, Inkpen, Snell, Batten, Brain

Offline NDRFT

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Re: Paupers, public and mass graves.
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 06 February 10 08:35 GMT (UK) »
Hi
This may be of interest?
I was recently looking through the burial records in a City Cemetery and was surprised to see 2,3 or 4 names recorded to the same plot.
On inquiring about this I was informed that in the event that some one with no known nok or where a family could not afford a grave then the 'council' or 'governing body' would bury the body. That plot would remain undisturbed for 12 yrs.
If by then neither the family or nok or an organisation had come along and paid for the grave then the grave would be re used until 4 bodies were in the plot.
This was one of the principles used throughout the country apparently and not unusual.
Fascinating as it is and also I am told a practice still used today!
Robinson - Oxfordshire
Stratford - Gloucestershire,
Waters - Northamptonshire,
Moss - Oxfordshire,
Bint - Berkshire,
Collins / Collings - Buckinghamshire,
Salmon - Warwickshire and Northamptonshire
Stranks - Northamptonshire,
Bull - Oxfordshire /Buckinghamshire,

Offline NDRFT

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Re: Paupers, public and mass graves.
« Reply #7 on: Saturday 06 February 10 08:37 GMT (UK) »
I am also aware of mass graves being used for burials of folks who died from plague, flu pandemics and so on. In Minster Lovell there is a 'mass' grave of 6 siblings who all died of the flu as I recall. I hues it is the defintion of the word Mass which is relevant as well?
Robinson - Oxfordshire
Stratford - Gloucestershire,
Waters - Northamptonshire,
Moss - Oxfordshire,
Bint - Berkshire,
Collins / Collings - Buckinghamshire,
Salmon - Warwickshire and Northamptonshire
Stranks - Northamptonshire,
Bull - Oxfordshire /Buckinghamshire,

Offline elin

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Re: Paupers, public and mass graves.
« Reply #8 on: Saturday 06 February 10 10:50 GMT (UK) »
I had no idea that such a practice was still in use!  My original query was in respect of Gt Grandfather
who was buried at Ford Cemetery in Liverpool.  They apparently used a large area of the cemetery for paupers graves but kept no record of where they had buried them.

I just discovered this week that another Gt Grandfather was buried with 4 others who all died in the same week.  On this occasion at St Helen's Cemetery and records have been kept of a grave no etc.

Elin
Foxwell (Wotton Under Edge and South Wales), Howell (Stroud & Wotton Under Edge), Jones (South Wales) Merrigan (Liverpool), Kelly (Liverpool) Titley (Lincolnshire and Staffordshire)  Hellier (Somerset and Monmouthshire)           All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk