Frederick PRINZ (1840-?)

[Gaie]

Hi

Well, your first reference point would be to obtain the marriage certificate that Tati has found for you; as she says, it should hopefully give you Frederick's father's name and occupation. 

My reading of the 1881 Census is that he was born in Grumbach, Prussia, which is now part of Germany; and he was a naturalised British Subject.

So to check this out you would need to access the parish records for Grumbach and look for the birth of Frederick around 1840.  Hopefully the birth record will show the same father's name as the marriage certificate.

You haven't given any indication on your personal details as to where you are in the world  but I'll assume you are living in the UK.  To find your nearest LDS centre take a look at this:

http://www.londonfhc.org/content/other-uk-centres

You can order the film (I think it costs about £7 for two months) to your nearest LDS centre that has a film viewer, but as far as I know you have to go in person to the centre to make the order.  It may take a couple of months to arrive as they will probably have to copy it in Salt Lake City and send it to the UK, but having ordered and viewed a number of European parish register films myself, it is well worth the wait!

The film number is 1528777 (from my previous link).

Regarding immigration, passenger lists between ports in Europe were not kept unless the ship was travelling further to The United States, Canada, etc, so you are unlikely to find your Frederick this way.

I can't see naturalisation records for Frederick at the National Archives, but many people became naturalised just by living here for a certain time (or just stated they were naturalised  ):

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/

Kind regards
Gaie

[Jamesk10]

Thanks Gaie for all that useful information!

I am indeed living in the UK but unsure at the moment which LDS centre would be easiest to get to, I will have to look at travel options. How do I go about actually ordering the film? I assume I would have to contact whichever centre I was going to go to and they will be able to assist?

How would I go about obtaining a copy of the birth certificate? Hopefully this wont take several months like waiting for the films!

[Gaie]

I'm not sure if there were birth certificates at that time in Prussia/Germany; I take a digital camera with me when I go to look at the films and I take a photo of the batism/marriage/death from the film viewer screen - it's allowed and it's free  .  Or you can have a paper copy or upload to a memory stick, but they will charge for these.

I'd phone up and ask your nearest one; they are usually very helpful.

Kind regards
Gaie

[JustinL]

The LDS film referenced is for Grumbach in Thuringia. In 1840, it was not part of Prussia.

Although there are several Grumbachs in modern Germany, I am fairly certain that the only Grumbach within Prussia at the time was the one in the modern-day state of Rheinland-Pfalz, close to the French border. It became part of Prussia in 1834.

Civil registration was introduced by the Prussians after German unification in 1871, so you will need to locate the parish registers (Kirchenbuecher) to progress any further.

If you can read German there is a wealth of information on this website www.grumbach-pfalz.de This attached picture dated 1870 (!) is taken from the website.

Justin

[Gaie]

Ah, thanks for that, Justin    Sorry, JKeen09, for sending you off in the wrong direction; Justin is the cavalry as far as eastern European matters are concerned on this site - he knows his stuff!!!!.

The only film the LDS seem to hold for a Grumbach, Rheinland, parish registers is for 1752-1798: #493269; not much help to you at the moment.

Kind regards
Gaie

[Jamesk10]

Thanks for all the info JustinL and Gaie 

I'm just confused though on what and how to do now!? 

[JustinL]

Gaie - kind words indeed, thank you. They brightened my day, unlike the weather here does.

Jesse - When I have time, I will have a search around on the web to locate the church or state archives which hold the right Kirchenbuecher.

The second LDS film that Gaie found has been referred to as Kirchenbuch I.  The cut-off year probably has something to with the French occupation. No doubt the French introduced civil registration - Napoleon was amazingly forward-thinking. In many ways the clock was turned back after the French had been booted out in 1815.

Justin

[JustinL]

Right, I am presuming that this man was born in Grumbach in Kreis Kusel in Rheinland-Pfalz (Rhineland-Palatinate).

The parish registers (Kirchenbuecher) are held at:

Archiv der Evangelischen Kirche im Rheinland
Archivstelle Boppard
Mainzer Straße 8
56154 Boppard
Germany
 
Tel. 06742/86194,
Fax. 06742/86196
archivstelle.boppard [at] ekir.de

The website (in German) offers lots of advice to visitors and appears to expect genealogists to visit the archives in person. There is no mention of fees for postal enquiries, etc. If they are prepared to do some research, it would come at a price - I have paid about €30 an hour at other church archives!!

Like many small villages in Germany, Grumbach is really quite beautiful, nestling on the side of a hill.

Here are some photos http://grumbach.gr.funpic.de/Bilder.html

Viel Glueck (good luck)!

Justin

PS Have you found Frederick/Friedrich in the 1911 census? I note that he was recorded as a German subject in both 1891 and 1901. The information given in 1881 would appear to have been incorrect.

[Jamesk10]

Thanks for all that information 

I have just looked him up in the 1911 census.

Persons listed:

name: Frederick Prinz
relationship to head: -
marital status: married
years married: -
sex: F (!!  i have already reported this and it has been confirmed should be M!
Age: 72 (search result said b: 1839 not 1840)
Occupation: Journeyman Baker
Where born: Greenback Germany

The only other person listed (he is not living with family now it seems)

name: Thomas Higgins
relationship to head: head
marital status: married
years married: -
sex: M
age: 63
Occupation: Baker of confectioner
Where born: Newton Long Ville Buckinghamshire

other details:

PRINZ FREDERICK (RG14PN742 RG78PN25 RD9 SD3 ED31 SN299)
Address: 164 OSSULSTON ST SOMERS TOWN N W
County: London
District: St Pancras
Subdistrict: East St Pancras
Enumeration District: 31
Parish: St Pancras