looking for family of Richard Davies b 1852/3 Llangadfan

[jasper1]

Hello I hope you can help.
I am researching my dad's family tree and having a lot of difficulty on the paternal side. His surname is Lloyd-Davies. How it evolved from Davies to Lloyd-Davies in three generations is a mystery which I am trying to unravel.
I have a copy of a Welsh bible with 'Richard Davies Glanmorfa Llangadfan July 25 1873 aged 20' written on the flyleaf. It has been in the family for years.
I think he was my great grand-father's brother.
This is all I know of my family from my dad (now aged 80):-
His grandfather was David L Davies born about 1849 in Llangadfan. He married Adelaide Ellen Youngman a Suffolk miller's lass, goodness knows where they met, but from the late 1870s the family was living in Cheltenham where he worked as a tailor. 
His son was Edward Lloyd Davies, born in Cheltenham in 1886.
My dad knows nothing about David L Davies other than he had a brother, the aforementioned Richard.
There were two daughters whose father was ?Richard? or another brother? - these were Edward L-D's cousins although as a child I called them great-aunts.
Margaret Davies or Lloyd Davies (aunty Maggie) born about 1891 lived in the hamlet of Minllyn near Mallwyd near Aberangell. She was a spinster and provided lodgings for the church minister.
The other sister was Mary (aunty Polly). She was born in the 1890s and married Tom Rees who was a slate miner at Corris near Machynlleth. They lived at a house called Bryn Massarn in Aberangell and had no children. They are both buried in the church yard in Aberangell.

I would be really appreciative of any help in working out which is 'my' David Davies!
As my grandfather Edward Lloyd-Davies was the only son of David Davies, my own father, as the only son of Edward, is the last of his line. It would be good to know if there are any Davies blood relatives still around.

[Ladyhawk]

David L Davies born about 1849 in Llangadfan married Adelaide Ellen Youngman  Suffolk 1870s the family was living in Cheltenham where he worked as a tailor. His son was Edward Lloyd Davies, born in Cheltenham in 1886.

[/color]

Hi Jasper1,

Hope I've got the order right starting with your father

Mr. DAVIES aged 80
only son of
Edward Lloyd DAVIES b1886 Cheltenham
only son of
David L DAVIES b1849 Llangadfan occ. Tailor married
Adelaide Ellen Youngman b1850 Suffolk.

As a starting point you could order David's marriage certificate, this would confirm David & Adelaide's fathers names.

www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates

Here is the marriage entry from BMD site for

David Lloyd DAVIES
Adelaide Ellen YOUNGMAN

Dec. qtr. 1879 District Cheltenham Vol. 6a Page no. 831

As my grandfather Edward Lloyd-Davies was the only son of David Davies, my own father, as the only son of Edward, is the last of his line. It would be good to know if there are any Davies blood relatives still around.

[/color]
It would seem that David & Adelaide had another son before your grandfather Edward Lloyd Davies b1886 Cheltenham
see details from 1881 census below

2 Caledonian Cotts King St Cheltenham, Gloucester, England

David L DAVIS head age 32 Mongomery Tailor
Adelaide E DAVIS wife age 31 Suffolk Dress maker
John F DAVIS son age 3 Cheltenham   

RG11 / 2571 / 96 / 15 

I have a copy of a Welsh bible with 'Richard Davies Glanmorfa Llangadfan July 25 1873 aged 20' written on the flyleaf. It has been in the family for years. I think he was my great grand-father's brother.

[/color]

I don't know whether this is a coincidence on the 1881 census there is a Richard Davies b1853 Llangadfan with father Edward Lloyd DAVIES - Could this be David L DAVIES brother & father (note the dwelling place name)

Edward DAVIES      Head      M      69  b1812 Llangadfan Turner      
Margared DAVIES      Wife      M      71  b1810  Llangadfan   Dressmaker      
Margared DAVIES      Daur      U      30  b1851 Llangadfan   Dressmaker      
Richard DAVIES   Son  U      28 b1853 Llangadfan Sawier     
Hugh DAVIES             Son      U      20  b1861 Llangadfan Setrcorier      
Thomas Edward DAVIES      Grand Son  4 b1877 Manchester

(Grandson Thomas could be their daughers Margaret's son or did theyhave another son) 

Dwelling, Glanmorfa, Llangadfan, Montgomery, Wales
 RG11 5496 / 25 / 6    

Unfortunately I don't have access at present to view censuses on line to see if Richard & David are together with father Edward DAVIES on 1851 or 1861c but I'm sure someone will take a look for you.

There's an entry on
1861c
Edward Lloyd DAVIES b1812 married to Margret registration district Llanfyllin, sub-dist. Llanfair
and
1851c Edward DAVIES b1812 married to Margret reg. dis. Llanfyllin   

Hope this helps a little   

 DAVIES becoming LLOYD-DAVIES perhaps one of the son's took their mother's maiden name 

   




 

[jasper1]

Thank you that is so helpful.
I asked dad about his father's older brother John F Davies. He was John Fitt Youngman, Adelaide Ellen's son by a former relationship but brought up as a Davies. Adelaide also had a daughter, Laura Youngman who was in service at the time of that census. My dad's aunty Laura was born in 1871 and died in Cheltenham aged 100. She remained a spinster, was in service all her life and is buried next to Edward Lloyd-Davies, her half brother and my grandfather, in Cheltenham.
Many thanks for inspiring me. I am now intrigued about the 1881 census - Edward and Margred Davies'
grandson Edward born in Manchester!
And who was aunty Maggie and aunty Polly's dad I wonder?

[Ladyhawk]

Many thanks for inspiring me. I am now intrigued about the 1881 census - Edward and Margred Davies'
grandson Edward born in Manchester!

Hi Jasper1,

You could put a request on the England Lancashire board and ask if anyone can look up Thomas Edward DAVIES b1877 Manchester on 1891 & 1901c - hopefully he may be back living with his parents

On FreeBMD there are a few births for a Thomas Edward DAVIES around 1876/77 

Ladyhawk 

[Ladyhawk]

Hi Jasper1,

Good news I hope this could well be the link to your LLOYD-DAVIES family as both David b1849 & Richard b1854 Llangadfan, Montgomery together on census with father Edward Lloyd Davies and with David naming his son b1886 Edward Lloyd Davies and the house/place name same as written in your bible Glanmorfa.

1861 census RG9 / 4260 living at GLANMORFA

Edward Lloyd Davies head 42 b1819 occ. Sawyer
Margred Lloyd Davies wife  49 b1812        Dressmaker (possibly Margaret)
John            ditto        son   15  b1846       Sawyer
David             "           son    12 b1849       scholar
Margred         "           dau   11 b1850            "
D....?              "           dau   10 b1851            "           
b]Richard           "           son     7 b1854            "[/b]
Jane Elizabeth "          dau     5 b1856            "
Hugh               "           son     2 b1859 

all born in Llangadfan, Montgomery.

And who was aunty Maggie and aunty Polly's dad I wonder?

perhaps the the father of Margaret & Mary (Polly) Davies was Hugh I don't think it's John see 1881 RG11/5544 / 48/2 below

Hendre Isa Llanymowddwy, Merioneth, Wales
1881 census
 John DAVIES              Head  M 35      Llangadfan      Farmer Laborar      
 Elizabeth DAVIES      Wife   M 33      Llangadfan    Laborars Wife      
 Ann DAVIES              dau       11      Llangadfan      Scholar      
 Elizabeth DAVIES      Dau    9      Llangadfan      Scholar      
 Margaret DAVIES      Dau     6      Llangadfan      Scholar


Re: your gg/f David Lloyd DAVIES - sorry don't have full details of the census

1891 Cheltenham
David L Davies   42
Adelaide E         40
John F                13
Margaret E          9
Edward L            5
 
1901 Cheltenham
David Davies         52
Ellen                      51
Laura Youngman   30
Margaret Davies    19
Edward Davies      15


Edward DAVIES b1816 occ Sawyer on 1841 c Montgomery &
Edward DAVIES b1813 Llangadfan occ.Sawyer on 1851 c Mongomery, sorry but I can't check it out for you as I've just used up last of my credits   

I wonder if you find the marriage of Edward DAVIES to Margred/Margaret whether her maiden name was LLOYD or the birth record for Edward DAVIES b1819 whether his mother's maiden name could be LLOYD 

Hope you find out who the parents are of Thomas Edward DAVIES b1877 Manchester and who's the father of Margaret & Mary DAVIES

Good Luck


forgot to add

death entry for
 Edward Lloyd DAVIES aged 69
 Sep q 1881 Llanfyllin vol. 11b page 138

1891c parish of Llangadfan RG12/4599/104/10

Richard DAVIES Head age 37 occ joiner &
Hugh DAVIES brother age 30 occ. gen. labourer
both born Llangadfan & single

[Ladyhawk]

Hi Jasper,

Don't know if you've have the following but I think this maybe your DAVIES family from 1841 

1841c HO107/1438/7/4 Llangadfan

Edward DAVIES head age 25 Sawyer
Margaret            wife        30
Emma                 dau           6
Edward               son           5
Margaret            dau           3
Jane                   dau           2
Dorothy              dau           3 months

1851c HO107/2499/198/14

Edward DAVIES head age 38 sawyer
Margaret            wife         39
Emma MORGAN   dau         16
Edward DAVIES   son         15
John                                    5
David                                   3
Margaret             dau          1

1861 census RG9 / 4260 living at GLANMORFA

Edward Lloyd Davies head 42 b1819 occ. Sawyer
Margred Lloyd Davies wife  49 b1812        Dressmaker (possibly Margaret)
John            ditto        son   15  b1846       Sawyer
David             "           son    12 b1849       scholar
Margred         "           dau   11 b1850            "
Daret             "           dau   10 b1851            "           
b]Richard           "           son     7 b1854            "[/b]
Jane Elizabeth "          dau     5 b1856            "
Hugh               "           son     2 b1859 

all born in Llangadfan, Montgomery

1871c RG105627/64/1 Glanymorfa

Edward DAVIES head age 58 sawyer
Margred             wife         59
Margred             dau          21
Richard               son          16
Hugh                  son           12
Evan PRYCE  grandson         9

all born Llangadfan

1881c Glanmorfa, Llangadfan RG11/5496/25/6

Edward DAVIES      Head      M      69  b1812 Llangadfan Turner      
Margared DAVIES      Wife      M      71  b1810  Llangadfan   Dressmaker      
Margared DAVIES      Daur      U      30  b1851 Llangadfan   Dressmaker      
Richard DAVIES   Son  U      28 b1853 Llangadfan Sawyer     
Hugh DAVIES             Son      U      20  b1861 Llangadfan Setrcorier ??     
Thomas Edward DAVIES      Grand Son  4 b1877 Manchester

1891c parish of Llangadfan RG12/4599/104/10

Richard DAVIES Head age 37 occ joiner
Hugh DAVIES brother age 30 occ. gen. labourer

both born Llangadfan & single

Ladyhawk 

[poplin7]

Hello Jasper1,
I believe we are related.  My gr.gr grandfather was Richard Davies born in 1852 in Loughor.  He was married to Sarah Hanson Rees, born in 1851 in Glamorganshire.  They had 6 children.  Their daughter, Sara Jane Davies was born on 3 April, 1873 in Cwmafon.  (my great grandmother)
I hope we can share more information.   I'm happy the bible has stayed in the family.  I don't believe I can help you solve the Lloyd-Davies mystery, though!   
Hope to hear back,
Poplin7   

[Rowdy]

Edward Lloyd Davies was my Gt-Gt Grandfather. I have copies of the Parish records from 1772 to 1879 for Llangadfan. I have only just come across this posting and not read all the replies yet but I will read them later and hopefully I can be of some help. Will reply again after I have digested what has been sent.

[Rowdy]

I can explain where Lloyd came from in Edward Lloyd Davies (b1812).

Edward Lloyd Davies Grandparents were Richard Thomas and Elizabeth Lloyd.
His parents were David Davies b1775 in Moelfeliarth Montgomeryshire and Baptised on 1 Jan 1776 in Llangadfan and Dorothy Thomas b 1771 in Llangadfan.
Edward Lloyd Davies had four sisters and one brother David Davies b 1808.
He married Margaret (Margred) Davies (b1812) in Llangadfan in 1835
They had 14 children of whom 5 died in 1849 of Scarletina.. Emma Morgan was the illegitimate daughter of Robert Morgan & Margaret Davies the year before she married Edward. There are a couple of things to bear in mind. When a child died they named the next baby after the one who had died which is confusing and do not confuse John Davies b 7 Feb 1846 in Llangadfan with John Davies (Later John Cadvan Davies) born 1st October 1846 in Llangadfan. He was the son of Richard and Jane Davies and was famous. 
 This information is from the transcript of the Llangadfan Parish Records by Montgomeryshire Genealogical Society.