Orpington Orphanage St. Joseph and Anne records

[salclem]

Hello,
 Does anyone know where the records are held to the old orpahange of St. Joseph and Anne in Orpington?
 My grandmother and her brother and sister were there in the late 1890s/ early 1900s after being rescued from the workhouse in SouthwarK where their mother remained, although their father moved in with his parents who were realtively wealthy.
 I have looked at the very informative site
http://www.holyinnocents.org.uk/pages/History_HI_Parish1.htm
but there is no mention of records. I have also tried contacting the Holy innocents Church whose priests ran the orphanage, but had no replies.
The orphanage is no longer there, it is now a housing estate.
 Any information is most welcome,
      Many thanks,
         Sally

[Sisterjane]

Hi
Have you a name age etc of the person you are looking for

Joe

[salclem]

Hello Joe,
 Thanks for the reply. Our grandma was Emma Elizabeth McMahon and was born 7/4/1897. In the 1901 census she was in the St. Joseph and Ann Orphanage aged 3, along with her brother James aged 7 and sister Rose aged 10 ( Rose was short for Rosina ).
 All 3 children were born in Southwark, Rosina in the Mint street workhouse, but Emma and James at home in the slum areas then called " The Grottos".
 Emma went into service in London when she was older, but I would love to know when she went into the orphanage, and when she left, and especially the details of why she and her siblings were admitted there.
      Best wishes,
          Sally

[Sisterjane]

Hi Sally
Was the mother of these children called Elizabeth? Ive done a bit of digging and come up with a couple of possibilities . Was there a father that you know of or any more children.

Joe

[salclem]

Hello again Joe,
    Yes, their mother was Elizabeth McMahon, her maiden name was Laurence. She was born around 1865, her father Edward Laurence was an ostler.
Elizabeth married James Mcmahon 10/11/1889, he was a tailor. They had a number of addresses in Southwark over the next few years. Family stories have always been that Elizabeth Laurence was not seen as being good enough for James so maybe there was some hostility from his family towards her.

 In 1901 Elizabeth was in the workhouse, and James was back with his parents and sisters in their home and business ( china and fancy goods shop) at Walkers Court, St. James, Westminster . Previously James' parents James and Emma had run a similar shop in Suffolk Street Southwark when James stopped working as an engineer.
James' father was suffering from dementia around 1901, so it may be that James was needed to help physically manage him....although I can't imagine he would leave his wife in the workhouse and children in an orphanage for this reason.
   I would love to know the real circumstances of the children being taken into the orphanage,
   Best wishes,
       Sally

[Sisterjane]

Hi Sally
The Civil registration index 1837-1983 show Elizabeth Lau/wrencewas married to JOHN Mcmahon 1889 Dec Q .
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
1891 CENCUS St Savior Southwark
John Mcmahon 23 head b Southwark     Tailor
Elizabeth Mcmahon 24 wife b Southwark
ROSE Mcmahon 3m dau b SOUTHWARK
-----------------
RG12/350
Folio19
St Savior
-----------------------------------------------------
1901 CENCUS Newington Workhouse

Elizabeth Mcmahon 34 b Southwark     Laundress
Edward Mcmahon 3m b London Boro
--------------------------------------------------
Not sure if Edward was Elizabeths son but he was next to her on the list and Edward was her fathers name
I cant access original images at the moment for the address in 1891 but as soon as i can i will post it. Iwill look for John and see if i can find him.

Joe

[Sisterjane]

1871 cencus  St George Southwark

MCMAHON
James 27 head b Deptford, Kent             Engine filler
Emma 23 wife b Southwark
James 4 son            ''
JOHN 2 son b           ''
Philip 3m son b         ''
-----------------------------
RG10/602
Folio 110
Address      28 John St
---------------------------------

Joe

[salclem]

Thanks Joe, you  are a gem!
 These are our relatives you found. We thought Emma McMahon had a younger brother but could find no trace of him, so Edward looks likely. Maybe Elizabeth went into the workhouse to have the baby. When Rose was born there, accordng to her birth certificate the family's address was Queen's Buildings Southwark.
 Elizabeth married John as you found, we have their marriage certificate for 10/11/1889. John used both the names John and James during his lifetime, although family usually called him John.
    Thank you very much again for your help,
         Best wishes,
            Sally
 

[Sarah68]

My dad and uncle both spent their childhoods at St Joseph's and after lots of searching we found their case notes/files (care file) at:

London Metropolitan Archives, Corporation of London, 40 Northampton Road, London EC1R 0HB.  Tel: 020 7332 3820

We were given copies of their files.

It might be helpful to get in touch with The Catholic Children's Society first (they hold Admission Registers only) but they gave us useful information "to quote when applying for access to care files at London Metropolitan Archives" (we actually did it the other way round, got files from London Metropolitan before getting in touch with The Catholic Children's Society).

The Catholic Children's Society were helpful and provided some interesting information that wasn't in their care files.

The Catholic Children's Society, 49 Russell Hill Road, Purley, Surrey CR8 2XB. 

Tel: 020 8668 2181.  Email: info@cathchild.org

website catholicchildrenssociety.org.uk

Best of luck in your search.