James NELSON - COMPLETED

[dalek39]

I'm not having a good day today. I was in the middle of "chatting" when it dropped out...start again..
There are soooooooooo many James Nelson's born in 1863...which makes it hard to locate unless we get his day/month of birth as well...same with Mary (wife) as she was a Donovan before marriage, but I have discovered that her middle name was Jane.....Mary Jane Donovan / Nelson.. so I will just have to wait till the Archives on his Convict details come fourth...they may have dates, other than discriptions.
I have them...but...thats not enough.. anyway..will plod on..who knows what we'll "dig up"...(sorry about that)

[cando]

There are soooooooooo many James Nelson's born in 1863.

Oops don't you  mean he was born 1836.

I was actually referring to Flora's siblings [sisters] not her children.  Have you traced them at all?  Your online tree gives little info about them.  Of course the tree may not be up to date.

Gosh aren't you doing it the hard way...trying to find graves before finding the death regs  

If your grandmother returned to Adelaide in 1926 your gt grandfather would have been 90 years old as you wrote he was born 1836.

Are there any identifying marks on the photograph ie is it a studio photo?

There is a death of a Mary [no Jane] NELSON in Adelaide however the year of birth is 1848 and you mentioned Mary Jane was born 1845. ?Source.

NELSON  Mary
25 May 1930   82 years  Status Widower  Relative James NELSON[Deceased husband]
Residence Adelaide  Death Place Adelaide   Ade 521/95

A transcription of her death registration may give you more identifying information if known to the informant.  However South Australian death certificates for 1930 detail the following -

1908-1947 - [From Australian Resources - South Australian Resources on the Australian board.]
    * Date and Place of Death
    * Name
    * Sex
    * Age
    * Occupation
    * Usual Residence
    * Birthplace
    * Length of Residence in Commonwealth
    * Age at Marriage
    * Number of Issue Living and Deceased
    * Cause of Death
    * Place of Death
    * Informant

Transcriptions are available from
http://www.jaunay.com/transcription.html
http://www.saghs.org.au/research.htm#transcription

Places of burial are not listed on SA death certificates until 1948.

I can see no James NELSON buried at Burra, only a James Stanley NELSON who died in 1893 aged 6 months with father James NELSON.  The Mary NELSON buried in 1909 was aged 76 years and the death reg is noted in the name of Maria, widow of Samuel NELSON.

From the death indexes -
1842-1915
Seven deaths - James NELSON - 6 children and 1 adult in 1879.

1916-1936 [James being born 1836]
One on 28 Jul 1924 aged 83 years ie b. 1841   Status Married and died at Adelaide. Ade 472/30

Just to make it confusing, I can see three couples with the names James NELSON with wife Mary in the indexes.

If you knew where Flora's sisters had married and lived, it  may help trace the gt grandparents.  I emphasize the 'may'

Have you only searched online cemeteries in SA?  A number of the large metropolitan cemeteries do not have their records online. There are a couple of websites that list the names of those only with headstones.

I would suggest seeking help on the NZ board or have a search of the NZ bdm's.  Have you the passenger records for you grandmother and chn when she returned to Adelaide?

Cheers
Cando

[cando]

Could you please give me James and Mary's ages on their marriage cert in 1869...and let's hope they were truthful

The age quoted seems to refer to the age of the convict when the passenger list was created.  The PALMERSTON departed England in November 1860.

NELSON     James             
5835   10 years   27 years  Trial at Malta  1859                 .
Shooting at his superior officer [Army?]   

This would indicate that James was born c1833.          

Cheers
Cando

[dalek39]

Thanks for that Cando...not having a good day... but, I will look into all that you have asked and get back to you...
There has been a mix-up with me receiving other peoples posts..but hopefully that is being looked into..not my fault this time... unfortunately, being rather new at all this, one tends to get into trouble, and I dont understand all the procedure yet..but..learning fast.....I hope   Will get back to you ASAP with all the correct info that I know...and sorry he was born in 1836................not 63..  nice girl..not bright..at times...

[dalek39]

Cando....Oh boy, there is so much I dont know about these two, but I'll try and fill you in on what I do know.
There are no ages for them on their marriage certificate, only date of marriage..22 Nov.1969..James was a Harness Maker/Saddler...fathers name was also James Nelson. occupation ..Publican..
Mary Donovan's occupation was servant...fathers name was John Donovan..Painter..

Flora's sisters...I think I gave you their names and DOB...but, unfortunately all have died now, and I've lost touch with all but one, who's son does not have any information at all...
I found an old Aunt, (who knew them all, she is still alive at 92, but is in a nursing home, and unable to talk...

Henry Alfred...Flora's husband..died in 1926..but the family came out to Aust. later, maybe a couple of years later..I dont really know, as my Mother has also died, and there is no one to ask now.
I have looked at the photo and all it has on it is, Frank McNeil...Gawler Park Adelaide..no date..nothing..

I have it on record of her shipping list that she was born in England ? 1845..arrived on the Hastings on 28 Jan 1868. Western Australia...

I am decended from the Nelsons by my grandmother, James being her father...
My grandmother was married in Christchurch NZ on 14 Mar.1905. to Henry Alfred Donovan...she was 21..but I later found out, on a birth certificate on her that she was actually born in 1881..she always claimed she was born in 1883.
James and Mary's names were on the certificate, but in someones else"s handwriting, so I am unsure if they attended.

As far as getting their death registrations...thats not a problem..the question is which one to order?

I shall check the Burra deaths again, but I'm sure I saw a James and Mary Nelson there, apart from the ones you mentioned..I saw them also..
The James being born in 1836 .. one on the 28 Jul.1924..aged 83, even though birth is 1841 seemed to me to be him, but once again..that question???

I have searched online cemetries, plus the aid of "Headstone Transcriptions...South Australia.. They were very helpful to me, actually they were the ones that put me onto Burra....also a couple of cemetries I emailed for information..no go there....sooooooooooo..

Sorry if I get things back to front sometimes..but..I think my brain is shrinking with all the dates and names I've dealt with since I started this..How do YOU do it. anyway, I hope all this helps, and I'll try and get onto South Australia records..which might I add is difficult sometimes, as a lot of their info has gone...fire I think........

Thanks for at least trying to help me, we may go insane together over this. :

I

[cando]

These are the only burial records online for a James and Mary NELSON at Burra Cemetery.

NELSON James Stanley
Cemetery Burra Cemetery
Grave    1406
Date of Burial    07 Nov 1893
Grant Number    1406

and Mary

NELSON, Mary
Cemetery Burra Cemetery
Grave 1305
Age at Death 76
Date of Burial 16 Mar 1909
Grave Depth 7
Funeral Director C.J. Pearce
Grant Number 1305

I have given you details from the indexes for both these persons which eliminates them as being your family.

Is the address on the Frank McNEIL photographer, Gawler Park or is it Gawler Place?

I can find no photographer of that name in the history of photography in SA. However there was a T H McNEILL who operated his business under the name "SUPERB" STUDIOS.
http://www.artgallery.sa.gov.au/noye/Photogs/Phot_set.htm
> List of names in left menu and then scroll down.

Would have to look at a directory to find further info on his business address.

A South Australian 1909 electoral roll has this listing and as the address in close proximity to the City of Adelaide, it indicates to me that his studio would probably be in Gawler Place, but then again perhaps he travelled to Gawler [Park], which is north of Adelaide.  A fair trip in the early 1900's.

McNEILL  Francis Andrew, Castle Street, Parkside.  Occupation  Photographer.

Do you think you could post the photograph on the Restoration board for a dating opinion.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/board,298.0.html

Jennifer, I only detailed the two death registrations as possibilities.  Please do not feel under any obligation to purchase.  However if you wish to, usually the first deceased of a couple is the better option, as the information may have been given by their spouse.

I would certainly have expected Flora's siblings to be deceased however have you attempted to research them at all?    Do you know if they went to NZ or remained in Adelaide?  Have you any information about them at all?  Who did they marry?  Where did they live?  Perhaps with a little more information we can trace them.  Every little snippet helps

I have it on record of her shipping list that she was born in England ? 1845..arrived on the Hastings on 28 Jan 1868. Western Australia...

Are you sure this is your Mary DONOVAN?   There is another Mary DONOVAN b. Ireland arriving WA in 1862.  What I am attempting to do is find a date of birth on an official document. 

I think that is enough from me for today.  I'll leave you to go through the thread and perhaps address each query.

Cheers
Cando

[dalek39]

Cando...thank you very much for all that..I will look into things...and it was Gawler Place.. (photo)
I think we have a problem...not just me but I am not receiving your notices on my email re thread...I am getting other threads sent to me..the only way I know you have a message is if I get onto the thread itself, and look..I have reported this, and there is someone looking into it...is this happening to others as well as me.. I know I'm new at all this, but I dont think the problem  is at this end... re technical..that is
Do you think changing the thread to another "channel"  whatever you do may solve this problem..only a suggestion...
Re Mary Nelson....all I have is that she was born in 1845 England..but that may be wrong as far as place goes.... I will do what I can this end...re family of Flora...but, I have lost touch with their families, other than one, and she is 90 and not too good at the moment...
I will have to "digest" what you have written, and get back to you on Monday...

[cando]

Dalek when you log on to rootschat you can check new replies to your posts at the top of the page - it looks like this on your page

Welcome back, dalek39, you have xx messages, x are new.
Show unread posts since last visit.
Show new replies to your posts.

Click on to Show  new replies to your posts.

I have notifications turned off as I prefer to check myself.  I receive too many emails as it is

No channels on rootschat, just boards...and this request should probably be moved to the Australian  board.  You can request a moderator to do this if you wish.

Unfortunately when we take information from death certificates, it can be incorrect.   When I research I like to have at least three sources for my information if I can't see the primary source. 

I only mentioned Flora's siblings to assist you with researching the family.  James and Mary may have lived near one of their other daughters and died in the same area.

Cheers
Cando 

[cando]

Always seek help if you are have problems on here....someone will always come to your aid   I may not have explained things very clearly. 

Have you read?
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/board,287.0.html
and
http://www.rootschat.com/help/help_index.php

Cando

Moderator comment: moderators and admin team are assisting dalek to solve the issue.  Some posts removed since they relate to the 'technical difficulties' rather than the search for James Nelson.