New to huguenot records - connecting families - help sought

[richarde1979]

Whether you'll find him in the Mouilleron records Ben would depend I suppose largely on why he went through a reconnaissance in London, if it was because he was born a Catholic in France he may well be there. However given the obvious link of the Morins to lots of other Protestant families from same area in France, I think it's more likely he was born Protestant but forced to go to mass and renounce his Protestantism as an adult under duress, and if that is the case not likely a baptism that early (1685-95 ish) for a Protestant child in the Catholic registers will be found. He was likely baptised by his own Protestant minister, who may not have fled France at that point, and may still have been baptising in secret in homes etc, though they did so under threat of arrest and execution, and  their temples will have of course have been closed down and in many cases demolished.

[coombs]

Hi Richard

Would it be a good idea to check through Mouilleron registers up to 1717? Jean died in 1750 and is buried in Bethnal Green but no age is given however he must have been about 20 in 1717 when he had his reconnaissance.

Out of the two Francis Fradin's born in Moncoutant, it would be good to perhaps find a marriage of one of them in France or a burial which would eliminate one and the one who emigrated to London will no doubt be the other baptism.

Ben

[richarde1979]

Hello Ben

He could have been any age when he went through his reconnaissance, but given he didn't marry and have children until a good few years after, I would have thought he was probably quite young 18-25 at best guess. It is certainly worth checking the registers, as he may have been given Catholic baptism, but as I say during that period for a Protestant child it is less likely than the latter period 1710 onwards. I had a brief look through them last night, 1692-1702 and noticed a couple of Morins, but no Jean Morin, and I didn't notice any baptism which would strike me as being to a Protestant couple.

[amackean]

Hi Richard,

I have been reading your posts and was very interested to see you mention the Machu family.

I have not long discovered that my husband's Gt Gt Gt Grandmother was Catherine Elizabeth Machu b 1795 daughter to Jean Henri Machu and Suzanne Catherine Bantigny . Catherine married Nathaniel Eastland in 1817.

All of the information I have has come from family search IGI  and ancestry receords as I live in Australia.

Would you be a able to point me in the right direction to find out more about this family. I know they were silk merchants and one line of the family did very well for themselves ( unfortunatley not Catherines).

Regards
Anne (Western Australia)

[elfinblues]

Hello Richard
Well, firstly, profuse thanks to you for the time you've taken to look into and write in reply to my initial query. I am incredibly grateful to you for your kindness in helping me to progress this line of my tree, so kind. I am currently at work, and so not able to access my own files and reply in full, so I'll PM you later this evening when I'm back at home.
With thanks and very best wishes,
Steve

[richarde1979]

Anne

The Machus were part of the latter wave of refugees from the town of Quievy, in the Cambresis. Most of the very last lot of refugess to England came from this village and nearby Wallincourt, where there were two very active Protestant temples and communities, and a very anti Protestant local Catholic Clergy.

The town has a website.

http://quievy.free.fr/index.html

I don't know how your French is but there is a very good section on the Protestants there (7 pages long) with photos of the Temple etc:

http://quievy.free.fr/protestant1.htm

There is also this site, a personal site by a Protestant of Quievy, which notes his family history and that of the town.

http://pagesperso-orange.fr/geneadavoine/

In addition Jean Paul Roellys excellent site on the Protestants of Picardy has a lot covering Quievy, and there are Machus mentioned on his site:

http://huguenots.picards.free.fr/donnees/cattelain/html/idx4d0.htm
http://huguenots.picards.free.fr/documents/etud1935.htm
http://huguenots.picards.free.fr/documents/quievy.pdf


Like most of the Protestants of this region they tended to trek across the border in disguise to celebrate their marriage at the Tournai Temple in Belgium. There are 9 Machu marriages there, all from Quievy:


15/02/1756 MACHU Jean Antoine of QUIEVY & DELWARD Marie Claire of QUIEVY

15/03/1761 MACHU Henry of QUIEVY & LEFEBVRE Marie Anne of MONTBREHAIN

08/11/1761 MACHU Jean Antoine of QUIEVY & LANGREND Marie Bertine of QUIEVY

04/07/1762 MACHU Jean Baptiste of QUIEVY & WATREMEZ Marie Angéliqueof QUIEVY

11/07/1762 MACHU Jacques Joseph of QUIEVY & GAUTIER Robertine Joseph of BETHENCOURT

15/09/1764 MACHU Jean François of QUIEVY & VILETTE Marie Philippe of QUIEVY

25/05/1765 MACHU Jean Philippe of QUIEVY & WAXIN Catherine Cécile of QUIEVY

09/06/1765 MACHU Michée of QUIEVY & MERESSE Marie Françoise of QUIEVY

31/10/1773 MACHU Pierre Antoine of QUIEVY & LORIAUX Marie Philippe of QUIEVY


The name is spelt variously in the English Huguenot records, Machu/Machue/Machut/Massu, but I believe is the same family, and where origin is given it is always Quievy, so I think it is a fair bet Jean Henri was originally of there.

These are the members who joined Threadneedle Street in London:

Machut, Jean Jacques, of Quievy in Flanders, Testimony of Monsieur Roy, 31 Aug 1740.
Massu, Jean Phillipe, by abjuration, 30 Sep 1750.
Massu, Abraham, Testimony of Monsieur Romilly, 25 May 1766.
Massu, Phillippe Jacques of Quievy in Cambrai, 31 March 1782.


The following three couples baptised children there:


Abraham Massu Jan 1 1749 to Jean Jacques Massu and Marie Madeliane.
Marie Madeliane Massu Oct 24 1750 to Jean Jacques Massu and Marie Madeliane.
Jacques Massu March 21 1754 to Jean Jacques Massu and Marie Madeliane.
Jacques Massue Oct 6 1756 to Jean Jacques Massu and Marie Madeliane.
Jean Massu March 3 1759 to Jean Jacques Massu and Marie Madeliane.
Jacques Massu Feb 11 1759 to Jean Jacques Massu and Marie Madeliane.


Pierre Louis Machu Feb 10 1792 to Pierre Phillipe Machu and Marie Bantigny (Godmother Susanne Catherine Bantigny)
Pierre Henri Machu March 2 1794 to Pierre Phillipe Machu and Marie Bantigny. (Godfather Jean Henri Machu).
Jean Pierre Machu May 15 1796 to Pierre Phillipe Machu and Marie Bantigny.
Marie Ann Machu April 8 1798 to Pierre Phillipe Machu and Marie Bantigny. (Godfather Jean Henri Machu, Godmother Susanne Catherine Machu).
Marie Caroline Machu Dec 29 1799 to Pierre Phillipe Machu and Marie Bantigny.


Jean Henri Massu (altered to Machu) March 10 1793 to Jean Henri Machu and Susanne Catherine Bantigny.
Catherine Elizabeth Machu Sept 20 1795 to Jean Henri Machu and Susanne Catherine Bantigny .
Marie Machu Feb 4 1798 to Jean Henri Machu and Susanne Catherine Bantigny (Godfather Pierre Phillipe Machu, Godmother Marie Machu).
Sara Machu Oct 13 1799 to Jean Henri Machu and Susanne Catherine Bantigny (Godmother Marie Machu).
Jacques Louis Machu Jan 23 1803 to Jean Henri Machu and Susanne Catherine Bantigny .

In addition Jean Henri Machu is Mentioned in a couple of trials at the central criminal courts in London (whether the father or the son I do not know) with his witness statements. They can be read online here:

http://books.google.com/books?id=uq0DAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA575&dq=%22John+henry+machu%22&lr=&cd=4#v=onepage&q=%22John%20henry%20machu%22&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=3a4DAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA141&dq=%22John+henry+machu%22&lr=&cd=6#v=onepage&q=%22John%20henry%20machu%22&f=false

Hope that helps

Richard

[richarde1979]

Hello Richard
Well, firstly, profuse thanks to you for the time you've taken to look into and write in reply to my initial query. I am incredibly grateful to you for your kindness in helping me to progress this line of my tree, so kind. I am currently at work, and so not able to access my own files and reply in full, so I'll PM you later this evening when I'm back at home.
With thanks and very best wishes,
Steve

No problem at all Steve, happy to be of help. I have a particular interest in these latter wave of refugees to London, my own ancestor being among them, and it tends to get overlooked, in favour of the larger waves that came 1680-1720. I have even read accounts where it has been stated that all Huguenot immigration to England had ceased by 1740, which as you see is absolutely not the case!

Best Regards

Richard

[richarde1979]

Anne

Interesting point, I noticed your Jean Henri Machu and his wife only ever appear as godparents outside their own family once, the baptism of Steve's family member Jean Henri Vasseur in 1795 (named after his godfather Jean Henri Machu?). In addition your husbands ancestor Catherine Machu's godfather was a Daniel Le Bailley. He was a master silk weaver, and my own ancestor Julien Francois Bellenger, was his apprentice (both their families were original from Athis, in Normandy and came over in the 1750's). So all 3 of our ancestors obviously used the church at same time and knew each other quite well. Thought I would mention this as it shows just how small and insular the French Huguenot community in London had become by 1780's and 1790's!

Regards

Richard

[amackean]

Hi Richard & Allan,

Thankyou so much for your replies . I have a lot to look at now.  Sees so strange that you Richard are helping with my queries yet our ancestors were probable close friends.  If they could see us now.

Richard, you mention a Gt Gt Granddaugher of Jean Henri Machu . Do you think she might want contact from a cousin?

Once again thankyou so much

Anne