Hello,
Sorry but I didn't receive notification of your reply, probably because I haven't posted here in such a long time. It was only by sheer chance that I came across it.
I spent time years ago looking for a connection between the Gilbert Ramsay family and Rev. James Ramsay but found none, apart from the Dukes of Roxburgh! I'm sure you already have much information but just as a re-cap to refresh my own memory:
Gilbert Ramsay, solicitor and factor to Robert Kerr, 2nd Duke of Roxburghe died in 1743. He was the eldest son of Alexander Ramsay, factor to Lord David Hay of Belton, East Lothian. Gilbert, I believe was also responsible for overseeing the building of Floors Castle, designed by Adam. Lord David Hay was the son of John Hay, 1st Marquess of Tweedale and Lady Jane Scott. He died in 1726. His sister, Margaret Hay married Robert Ker, 3rd Earl of Roxburghe in 1675. She died in 1753 aged 96 at Broomlands near Kelso.
The NAS also hold the Antenuptial contract of marriage between Gilbert Ramsay, Factor to the Duke of Roxburgh and Katherine Ker, dau. of Andrew Kerr of Kippilaw. [Seton-Carr Family, of Kippielaw, Bowden, Roxburghshire, private collection, ref: NRAS2970/Bundle 19, restricted access]
As far as I remember Gilbert Ramsay and Katherine Ker had two sons and five/six daughters who became milliners and dressmakers to the wealthy ladies of Edinburgh. Katherine in particular, together with her sister Ann made a fortune and built a house named Viewforth in Edinburgh. The locals made fun by referring to the building as Lappet Ha. Somewhere I have an amusing anecdote where Katherine and Ann arrived at a prospective client’s house dressed to the nines in the latest Paris fashion insisting that this much more mature lady dress exactly like them. She was not at all impressed, never calling on the Misses Ramsay again - made me think of Trinny and Susannah from the TV! See page 192:
https://www.rootschat.com/links/index.phpRev. James Ramsay, Minister in Kelso
I still have no idea who James Ramsay’s parents were, although I can say that his grandfather was also named James. Presumably they were Berwickshire people. His son, generally recorded as William Ramsay LL D of Templehall succeeded Gilbert Ramsay as Commissioner to Robert Kerr, 2nd Duke of Roxburgh in 1743, then after his death in 1755 to John Kerr, the 3rd Duke and renowned bibliophile. I have not found a birth record for William either but his younger brother, John, born 1710 was baptised at Kelso as witnessed by Sir William Ker of Greenhead and Gilbert Ker, Baillie. I am told they were brothers.
William Ramsay purchased Templehall, Coldingham about 1749. I don’t know if it was by accident or design but the ancestral home of this particular Ramsay branch was also named Templehall in the parish of Monifieth. The three eldest sons of William Ramsay and Ann Cumming; James, John Cumming and Alexander all died young leaving their fourth son Capt. David Ramsay RN with the family residue. All his papers are lodged with the NRS - I have barely scratched the surface. This is a transcription of one of them:
Letter addressed to Captain Ramsay, Royal Navy, Newhaven and dated 1 Sept. 1807, from N St Andrew's Street [in Edinburgh]
"Mr Sandilands with best compliments takes the liberty of informing Captain Ramsay that the precept of Clare Constat granted by Lord Torpichen's tutors in favour of Captain Ramsay's Father as heir to his Great Grand Father James Ramsay designed sometime of Templehall in the Templelands of Lawis otherwise called Muireheads lying in the parish of Monifieth and Sheriffdom of Forfar is dated the 2nd of July 1773." [NAS: GD274/24-8]
I understand that Sandilands was the family name of the Lords Torpichen, but it seems William Ramsay’s family did not hold on to these lands for long. Another letter addressed to David Ramsay from Alexander Ramsay Irvine (of Balmain) dated 1792 acknowledges receipt of seven title deeds dated between 1505 and 1604 showing the line of succession. The earliest charter was granted to Peter Ramsay of Ardownie. Subsequent inheritors were all named either Henry or John. The deeds themselves were later incorporated into the
Banff Charters published 1915.
So there we are - Kincardine Ramsays by the look of things. Thank you again for your post, I had reached the point of not being able to see the woods for Ramsays! So many of them and such complicated relationships - more to do with land transfer than anything, I suspect.
Regards, brigau