Elusive John Allans of Glasgow

[Stoodly]

Greetings,

I am trying to establish my great great grandfather John Allan's birth. According to the 1891 English Census he was born in Glasgow in 1836. This matches up with his death certificate which says he died in 1894 aged 58.

John Allan spent most of his working life in Penang, Straits Territories. I have yet to establish when and why he went there. He married twice firstly in 1863 and then again in 1866 and on his wedding certificates he names his father as also being John Allan - no mother recorded.

His first born son was also named John Allan and other subsequent children have the following family? middle names that I have not been able to eliminate via the maternal lines: Forbes, Hamilton (appears twice) McGregor and possibly Sinclair, though used as a first name.

Any ideas anyone?

Many thanks.

[RJ_Paton]

Unfortunately for you Civil Registration did not begin in Scotland until 1855.

Prior to that date the church records are the only ones available but these are sometimes poorly kept or haven't survived -

Scotlands people online a pay site has the official Scottish records . However the other main problem is that the Church of Scotland has an extremely fractious history and many dissenting congregations broke away from the main body of the Church and their records are not yet available online.

http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/

The Old Parish Records show 17 individuals named John Allan born in the Glasgow City area between 1830 and 1840 (only 2 in 1836) - BUT the OPR's can be frustrating and often only give the childs name and the fathers with no further information. (there are exceptions but these are relatively rare and depend on the dedication of the Church official at the time)

[MonicaL]

Hi Stoodly

Was there no occupation showing for John's father John showing on either of his two marriage certs? This might help you narrow down options on the early censuses perhaps.

Monica

[RJ_Paton]

The OPR's for marriages in the 6 years before your John's birth show 13 individuals named John Allan married in the Glasgow area (105 for the whole of Scotland) but none of the 13 had a spouse matching any of your additional surnames.

[Stoodly]

Thanks all, very frustrating indeed! Unfortunately the Penang records are minimalist and don't list occupation of parent nor even the mother's name.

John Allan, jnr, who went to Penang worked as a trader and was a member of the Legislative Council in Penang, so presume he was educated..........but that is all that I have to go on for now. HisEnglish death certificate which I have also yields no further clues.

I did have a look previously on the Scotlands People website but got bamboozled

Kind regards

[RJ_Paton]

Checking the 1841 Census index and giving a few years leeways for ages we have 3 children named John Allan living with a parent of the same name and within the boundaries of Glasgow.

The first possible is a family John Allan aged 35, Janet Allan aged 35 John Allan aged 4 and Isabella Allan aged 2 registered in the InnerHigh Registration District

Another, living in the Martyrs district
John Allan aged 25, Ann Allan aged 24 and son John Allan aged 2

Another, living in St George in the Field District
John Allan aged 27, Ann JAne Allan aged 25 and John Allan aged 2

There are several other children who match the name and age correctly but no link with a parent of the same name.

Unfortunately without further evidence it is unlikely that you can prove (or disprove) with any real certainty that any of these are your man.

[Stoodly]

Thanks for the lookup Falkryn.

Does the first John Allan listed state his occupation? I guess that might be the only other clue?

Do these folk also show up on the 1851 census?

Thanks in advance if you are able to look up.

Regards

[sancti]

What were the names of his children in birth order?

Did both marriages take place in Penang?

What was the nationality of his wives?

[sancti]

Possible on the 1851 census

John Allan
Age: 14
 
Occupation: Clerk To Commesscon Nurchant 

Mother's Name: Ellen F

Where born: Glasgow, Lanark

Civil parish: Barony
 
Address: 82 Buccleuch St