Help: Court Martialled & Missing in UK, Capt: Albert Edward Harrison AIF

[Craven-Harrison]

Hi there Plummergirl, Xin and Greensleeves,

thanks for your combined perspective and thoughts regarding Albert's misadventures, the philosophical aspects of historical mis-doings of our ancestors and this subsequent research regarding Albert and the Military.

I expect plenty of criticism over his deeds and I'm up for that and much more if necessary.  If Albert is anything like his brother Arthur (my grandfather) there will be lots more to this story before it ends and possibly a wild ride along the way.

The outcome of the explanation regarding Albert's Court Martial and his alledged crimes is a really positive process and outcome. Everybody gets another perspective and also more detail to aid in the research.  Good or bad information is what it is "information" it jogs my memory and assists me to get my head straight about the facts and the possible fiction. I like the devils advocate approach to shock me into action, in this case a defence of sorts.

I'm not happy about him not returning to his family, what he did to get Court Martialled is quite trivial in comparison to his no-show at home. I believe he felt that he couldn't return home to his children and keep his head held up!!!

Mysteriously missing records: (Xin's question)

The records that I speak off are his Australian records. I believe his normal military records are complete as are his Court Martial Records. However there are other files that are completely empty and yet the outer file cover does exist suggesting that there actually was something inside.

His DVA file is an example here, he shouldn't have one as he forfeited his right to any pension when he was dismissed, but he has a file cover in the Department of Veteran Affairs in Australia. I have often thought that given he apparently joined the British Military there may have been some exchange of information from Australia to the UK DVA in support of a claim for a pension later on.??

I have searched the British Medal Cards and Military records without success at this stage and am aware of the numerous types including the burnt series and the culling, yep it's quite possible that his British Officer history is burnt or destroyed but the London Gazette will have his entry into the British Army without question. The question is under what name!!

Ian

[Craven-Harrison]

G'day Carole,

no apologies are necessary, as previously identified I love a devils advocate approach and now we all know a lot more about the man, based on your criticism which is well founded given the info we have to hand.

I have to disagree with you about him having an easy time in WW1, He fought at Posiers and Ypres, enough said. Check out how may Australian's died in those battels, there are some Australian records that were set in these two areas.

There is a book currently in production that will account for the battle history of the 19th battalion at these two towns, I will drop the stats onto this site when it is published

Yes, the business of Syd's history having Albert's info included is a first for many military researchers and I have also wondered about his missing medical history, perhaps it was drawn for some sort of enquiry after his suicide which was apparently related to his Military and AEH related issues.

I actually thought that Syd was in England when Albert was Court martialled, I'm not sure how I know this, perhaps something his family has told me previously.

I have to agree with you about Albert's name, If he had Joined the British Military in his real name I would have found him by now. This is my stumbling block, what name and how do I locate this?

I'd better get off to sleep, it's 03:30Am in Oz

Ian

[Siamese Girl]

I'm trying to sort out the chronology of what happened in 1917:

29/01/1917 Syd was AWOL for a day and forefitted 4 days pay while he was at Perham Downs. Albert is in Rouen at this date
03/05/1917 Albert "advances" himself £15. He is at Perham Down now as well.
12/05/1917  Albert advances himself £25
23/05/1917 Syd used obscene language. (Perham Down)
29/05/1917 Syd is sent to France
03/06/1917-13/06/1917 Albert is AWOL
23/06/1917 Syd is fined £3-10s for the obscene language. By this date he is back in Perham Downs.
26/06/1917-29/06/1917 Albert is court marshalled. Dismissed that day and fined 87 days pay.
14/10/1917 Syd is awarded the Military Medal - do you know what for as this is the next entry to his fine and he still appears to be at Perham Down? Was he at Perham Down since the June?

I'm sure there must be some connection going on there but I just don't know what. It's all a bit of a mystery.

Carole

[Trillium62]

As odd as it may sound, is it worthwhile researching some people who may have had access to the missing files?  Perhaps he had a friend in a military records office who was willing to dispose of any embarassing information?

The clue about who might not be immediately useful, but added to the other information you've accumulated, it might suggest a direction.

[Redroger]

I find Trillium's suggestion very interesting, and had considered making a similar contribution as I know from personal experience on both sides of the fence so to speak that records can and do get lost either accidentally or accidentally on purpose so to speak. I agree this line of approach is worth pursuing also any connections with the General who spoke on his behalf. Were they both in the same Lodge perhaps? I believe some of these records exist and may throw light.

[Keitht]

Is it at all possible that Albert returned to Australia but not to his family?

An article extracted from the Pacific Island Monthly, Aug 1940 records that numerous members of the Nrw Guinea Volunteer Force, established by Australia, were commended. These included NGX71 HARRISON, Albert Edward.

The problem, of course, is that he would have been in his sixties by then.

Keith

[Craven-Harrison]

Hi Carole,

thanks for sorting out the Albert/Syd cronology, it's something I hadn't thought to do and it certainly does rule out Albert's urgent trip London as one where Syd could have been directly involved as he was apparently in France keeping the War going

So we still have Albert going to London for either Personal, Legal, Moral or Business.

If you were going to put your whole career or life on the line, it would have to be Personal, most business, legal, moral, arrangements can be made in writing or by proxy, men loose their heads sometimes in personal matters of the heart and I can't help thinking there was a love interest in London. again there is no actual evedance but the family had heard something of this nature was existing.

As for Syd and Albert, the business of the combined legal crimes on Syd's record speaks for itself, they were interrelated, so maybe the money was for Syd's mischief and the trip to London wasn't related to Syd at all

ian

[Craven-Harrison]

G'day Trilliam62 and Redroger,

A conspiracy or at the least a record conspiracy. Well, I certainly had considered this angle once or twice previously. When I cam up with file holders at the Australian Archives that had no contents, other than a number that was meaningless to the staff and me, is when I started to think I was researching a UFO.

He did embarrass the Government and the Australian Army when he was dismissed, was an Officer and didn't return to his homeland or more importantly his family and not just his wife and children, but a large extended family.

There remains in the Archives correspondence between the Prime Ministers Office, The Premier's Office and the Aus Army, regarding the lack of sense in Court Martialling men in England and then letting them loose, they should have been kept in custody and then returned. They hadn't considered that a man, having lost his self-respect might not want to return to the considerable scorn of his Country, family and friends. It would be a lonely voyage back home, and being an Officer would be a whole lot worse again

Notwithstanding all of this, there was a War raging and these seemingly trivial matters were just a nuisance.

Meanwhile back in Australia his wife was making noises, "where is my husband"? apart from what  we see in his records, I'm guessing there were lots of questions being asked in Oz and in England.

I do believe that he joined the British Military after 1917. I can't help thinking that at some point down the line, he would have made a call on the Military for help, either medical or financial perhaps a pension. Therefore, the absence of these documents in his Australian files might be explained by a transfer to the British Military?

I have worked for the Aus and Vic Government for 30 years now, and I couldn't believe that files could just go missing or be purposefully removed to change an outcome or to remove some degree of scrutiny, no, no, no, !!!!! ..............................LOL

I do believe one thing, once gone never recovered!!!!

I also believe that there will be some records that will throw some light on these matters that are peripheral to the primary issues here but will note or refer to some motives and hitherto unknown facts. Perhaps the Provo Martial case files are a start.
The trick is to ascertain what they are? I probably know where they are.

The major General who spoke for Albert was killed soon after the GCM reference was given so a dead-end there. As for the common Lodge, I'm sure he was "taught to be cautious" and so this will be sealed by time and square process!!!

One of the biggest issues here is that his old mates and family are all dead now. Therefore this research becomes an intellectual pursuit through the records. I am about to investigate the Australian Legacy aspect as I'm sure his wife would have accessed this organisation in her quest for sustenance

Thanks for idea, I'm not at all sure where to start on this aspect, but deserves some consideration

Cheers

ian

[Craven-Harrison]

Hi Carole,

something that I forgot in may last reply to you, I am tracking down the note left by Syd upon his demise by Suicide via the Coroners Inquest notes which I believe will exist

Thanks for the clue there

Ian