What happened to Malvina and Mary Ann Harvey?

[paulalou]

Hi all,

I'm trying to locate the whereabouts of two sisters of my direct ancestor, Joseph Frost Harvey. In total there were 7 children born to his parents, Isaac and Malvina Harvey, during the 1850s and 1860s in the Norwood/Southwark area. I've traced marriages for 5 of the children via the London Parish Records which were recently put online.

Isaac died in 1891 and his wife, Malvina, died in 1888. I'm trying to find what happened to their daughters, Malvina Maria Harvey (b 1860) and Mary Ann Laura Harvey (b. 1858). I have them in the 1881 census living together (not with their parents) in the St. George Southwark parish - Mary Ann's age was given as 10 years older than she really was. After the 1881 census I can't find any trace of them. The name 'Malvina' has been mis-transcribed in nearly every census record for this family so I'm wondering if I've missed something.

One of the brothers, Harry Francis Harvey, married in 1886 and one of the witnesses was a Malvina Harvey. However, I'm wondering if this may be their mother as the other witness was the mother of the bride.

Neither sister registered the death of their parents and the sisters are not living with any of their siblings in the 1891 census.

As the online shipping lists don't start until 1890 I don't know if the sisters migrated.

Any help/suggestions as to what might have happened to these sisters would be appreciated.

Paula

[t mo]

hi paulalou
are you hundred percent sure on the 1881 cen for malvina &mary only i,ve found malvina whose married but was born in kent & a mary born in hackney who is a servant in 1881 cen , probbly not yours but can you confirm either way
trevor

[paulalou]

Hi Trevor,

No that's not my Malvina. If you search under Mary Ann Harvey, born 1846 in Stoke Newington you should find them. As I mentioned the name 'Malvina' is mis-transcribed.

Paula

[t mo]

me again

ok i,m with you had seen what you,d said but just hoped it might have been them  you know what us men are like always think we know best !!!!!   will keep looking for you

trevor

[heywood]

Another one you may have already discounted:

1886 marriage - Mary Ann L Harvey St Saviour Southwark 

[paulalou]

Hi Heywood,

I've looked up that marriage in the London Parish records and unfortunately it's not the right Mary Ann (marrying Arthur Holloway), the 'L' is for Louisa and she had a different father.

I've looked for everything obvious surrounding Malvina and Mary, including trying to trace every Mary in the Lambeth/Southwark districts between 1881 and 1901. I'm really at a loss as to what happened to these women. I've tried searching the London parish records online to see if the father of the bride was given the wrong name but the correct job (he was a baker) - no luck.

[t mo]

hi paulalou
have you got the other brothers names by any chance only i,ve found an edward in stoke newington ? not much to go on i know this is for 1891 census  t

[paulalou]

hi paulalou
have you got the other brothers names by any chance only i,ve found an edward in stoke newington ? not much to go on i know this is for 1891 census  t

Edward wasn't a brother. Their siblings were:

William Walter Clark Harvey
Joseph frost Harvey (married Eliza baskett)
Louisa Amanda Harvey (married Francis thoma)
Isaac John Harvey (married Jane redburn)
Harry Francis Harvey (married Mary Ross)

I've traced all of these people to their deaths including on all available census records.

I was wondering if there was something a bit leftfield I hadn't thought about when trying to trace Malvina and Mary Ann.

[t mo]

hi paulalou
do you think from the info you,ve gathered on the family they were of a middle class background or more working class ,i,m wondering if say two sisters living together could opt out of the mainstream of life and get lost in the system especially if they lived by private income or more off thre wall join a nunnery who knows i,m sure things have happened like it before especially if they didn,t want to be parted , where else do two middle aged women go it,s possible they emigrated but i could understand it if it were two men especially in that era not so sure of two women , what,s your thoughts ? trevor