Elizabeth Fleshman 1851

[Dazey999]

1891 Bethnal Green
6 Cudworth Street

Ann Flashman 70 widow needlewoman b.Bow
Annie Cleary grand-daughter 10 b.Limehouse

RG12; Piece: 266; Folio 195; Page 1

MUST go to work now!!

[Dazey999]

So...Elizabeth seems to have had a younger sister, Louisa, born c.1861 in Exeter...so how about...
Marriage on 9 April 1882 - St James The Great, Bethnal Green
Louisa Flashman married Thomas William HOWARD (fishmonger)

[nigelp]

So...Elizabeth seems to have had a younger sister, Louisa, born c.1861 in Exeter...so how about...
Marriage on 9 April 1882 - St James The Great, Bethnal Green
Louisa Flashman married Thomas William HOWARD (fishmonger)

Louisa Flashman names John Flashman (deceased) as her father. Thomas Howard (deceased) is the father of Thomas William Howard.

There is also the marriage of Agnes Clara Kirby to Thomas Frederick Howard at St Michael, Wood Green in October 1900. Thomas Frederick's father is named as Thomas William Howard, fishmonger. This explains the witness to Ann Eliza'a marriage.

So if Elizabeth Flashman (Cleary) has become a Howard by the 1881 Census who is the father of the child with her in the 1891 and 1901 censuses? Additionally, where is Kate in 1881?

Nigel

[Dazey999]

I've found Kate's marriage:
28 Aug 1892 - St Matthew, Bethnal Green
to James Leftwich
(Lily was a witness)

[nigelp]

There is also the marriage of Ann Eliza Cleary, aged 20, to Arthur James Ingram at St Michael, Wood Green on 25 Dec 1901.  She names Philip Cleary, tailor as her father. The witnesses were George Frost Jobson and Agnes Clara Howard.

George Frost Jobson is head of the household where Kate and Lily are staying in 1891 (RG12; Piece: 1078; Folio 37; Page 17). He married Mary Catherine Flashman at St Matthew, Bethnal Green on 7 Sep 1879. John Flashman (smith) is Mary Catherine's father. Together with an Elizabeth Clark he witnesses Lily's wedding on 25 Dec 1896.

Nigel

[teaurn]

I am stunned   What an amazing lot of information you have all found for me.

Absolutely fantastic........... Thank you all so much.

Am trying to get my head around all the different names and family members you have found for me.

I can tell you that Elizabeth Clark is Lilys mother in law.  I have a copy of the marriage cert.

Now going to try and make sense of it all. back soon

 

[teaurn]

Ok.  Think I have most of the information clear in my head but still a few queries

Did anyone find a marriage between Philip Cleary and Elizabeth Flashman - I know I couldn't.

The only Louisa Flashman I could find on Freebmd was for 1849 but in Exeter.

I really need to remember to pay more attention to the witnesses.  I may have been able to find some of this out months ago

T

[nigelp]

Did anyone find a marriage between Philip Cleary and Elizabeth Flashman - I know I couldn't.

No.

The only Louisa Flashman I could find on Freebmd was for 1849 but in Exeter.

The 1871 Census indicates that Louisa was born in Exeter. However, she is aged 10 in the 1871 Census.

Nigel

[dee-jay]

Take a look at the WINSBOROUGH family in 1861:  RG09 piece 1395 folio 60 page 1.  Louisa WINSBOROUGH's birth was registered 1Q 1860 Exeter 5b 90 and none of the others appear to have been recorded WINSBOROUGH or variant at birth!

This beggars the question whether the Head of household was John FLASHMAN, and, if so, why the switch in identity?    Was this a reversion to his mother's maiden name by any chance?