Licensed Victualler or not?

[lesleymatt]

My paternal Great Grandfather Thomas 'Tom Hill was born in Halifax, Yorkshire in 1884.

1901 census shows he was a labourer in a Brickyard, lived in Siddal, Yorkshire
1911 census shows he was a clay miner, lived in Siddal, Yorkshire
1911 Oct. Married Mary Ann Bedford
1930 Electoral Roll shows he lived at 9, Oxford Terrace, Siddal with wife Mary Ann

He died in December 1930, now then, his will probate and his death certificate show he lived at The Prince of Wales, 22, Stainland Road, West Vale, Yorkshire.  His wife is also listed as living at this address at the time of his death.  BUT, his occupation is still listed as a Clay Miner.

1933 Shows Mary Ann living at 11 Oxford Terrace.

There has always been a story in our family that Tom Hill ran a pub.  But if he ran the pub, why would his occupation at death be listed as a Clay Miner.

The pub was turned into a house in 1960's, the present owners have been really helpful, digging out their house deeds, but to no avail.

The Brewery that originally supplied the pub was taken over by a larger brewery who in turn were taken over.  So they can't find any records.

Does anyone know of any archives that might have information on Yorkshire pubs and who ran them?  Or is this going to remain one of the family mysterys that never get solved?

Many thanks

[Evie]

Hi

Welcome to Rootschat

I don't know if you have seen this link but it does say that Tom Hill was the inn keeper/licensee or landlord in 1930.

http://freepages.history.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~calderdalecompanion/p200_p.html


Evie

[danuslave]

But if he ran the pub, why would his occupation at death be listed as a Clay Miner.

I think pubs then were a bit different to now.  Probably a lot smaller and much more limited licensing hours.

I have seen several census references to men who combined running a pub (or listed as beerhouse keeper in earlier times) with other occupations.  I suspect that in many cases, his name was on the license but his wife did a lot of the pub work!

Linda

[Evie]

Hi

Yes I agree with Linda, I have seen references where the licencee had another occupation.

The owner of the website I gave you, if I'm not mistaken is a member of Rootschat so he may well be able to tell you where his information came from. On the other hand you could get in touch with him via his website.

Evie

[lesleymatt]

Aha !!  We did wonder if his wife was the pub worker.  We couldn't work out why he was listed at two addresses in 1930.  Does anyone know when the electoral rolls were done in that year.  There isn't a date on the actual records, only the year.  If it was taken early in the year then I suppose they could have moved into the pub later the same year.

Evie - The information on Malcolm Bulls Site, Calderdale Companion, is what he put on their after I spoke to him about it, we were hoping that someone might see it and have some information.

Finding information on my dads family has become a mission for him and me.  My dad was taken to London from Yorkshire by his mother when he was a toddler, after his dad died as Japanese POW in 1943.  He has only rediscovered his Yorkshire family a few years ago and he is trying to find out all he can about the family he never knew.

It sure is turning up some skeletons and mysteries.

Thanks again.

[lesleymatt]

Just to let you know what we have now found out.

The Prince of Wales was a beer only house.

27/09/1930  Thomas Hill [my Gt.Grandfather] took up the licence of Prince of Wales

16/12/1930  Thomas Hill Died

31/01/1931  Licensed transferred to Mary Ann Hill [Thomas' widow].  She only stayed for a few months as sole licensee with her two sons, Jack and George.

28/03/1931  Harry Iredale took up the licence, he remained until December 1937 when the beerhouse closed.

Thanks for your help

Lesley

[Evie]

Hi Lesley

Thank you for letting us know what you have found.

What a shame Thomas died so soon after taking up the licence.

Evie

[lesleymatt]

Hi Evie,

Yes it does seem a shame. 

Just got to tie up one loose end.  After Mary Ann [Toms wife] left the pub, where did she go?  We cannot find any record of her on electoral rolls until 1933 when she turns up, living next door to the house where she used to live with Tom before they took over the pub.