Author Topic: 18 children by the same woman?!  (Read 25038 times)

Online carol8353

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Re: 18 children by the same woman?!
« Reply #9 on: Friday 29 October 10 17:11 BST (UK) »
Okay Jim,I take that back LOL  ;D

Dad must have forgotten how long he'd ben married !

I agree with you that must be them in 1871- although he's a labourer by 1881,and she must have been just about to give birth to the first one on the list in 1881 - 10 year old Fred.

Possibly a short pregnancy ,if they only just married in Oct 1870  ;)

Carol
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline toni*

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Re: 18 children by the same woman?!
« Reply #10 on: Friday 29 October 10 20:45 BST (UK) »
this is the 1881 census

 RG11;  3043;  109;  22;

it gives George as aged both aged 28 thus making them born 1853 or thereabouts 

if Clara gave birth to Fred in 1871 she would be just about 18 this would give her scope of a maximum 30 more years to have children and if she had one a year (not including multiple births) she could in theory have 30 children
Holman & Vinton- Cornwall, Wojciechowskyj & Hussak- Bukowiec & Zahutyn, Bentley & Richards- Leicester, Taylor-Kent/Sussex  Punnett-Sussex,  Bear/e- Monkleigh Gazey-Warwicks

UK Census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchive

Offline toni*

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Re: 18 children by the same woman?!
« Reply #11 on: Friday 29 October 10 20:48 BST (UK) »
Holman & Vinton- Cornwall, Wojciechowskyj & Hussak- Bukowiec & Zahutyn, Bentley & Richards- Leicester, Taylor-Kent/Sussex  Punnett-Sussex,  Bear/e- Monkleigh Gazey-Warwicks

UK Census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchive

Offline toni*

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Re: 18 children by the same woman?!
« Reply #12 on: Friday 29 October 10 20:50 BST (UK) »

His middle name is given as Dolman which may be significant.


Dalman or Dolman ???
Holman & Vinton- Cornwall, Wojciechowskyj & Hussak- Bukowiec & Zahutyn, Bentley & Richards- Leicester, Taylor-Kent/Sussex  Punnett-Sussex,  Bear/e- Monkleigh Gazey-Warwicks

UK Census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchive


Offline jim1

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Re: 18 children by the same woman?!
« Reply #13 on: Friday 29 October 10 21:06 BST (UK) »
yes you're right it's Dalman.

jim
Warks:Ashford;Cadby;Clarke;Clifford;Cooke Copage;Easthope;
Edmonds;Felton;Colledge;Lutwyche;Mander(s);May;Poole;Withers.
Staffs.Edmonds;Addison;Duffield;Webb;Fisher;Archer
Salop:Easthope,Eddowes,Hoorde,Oteley,Vernon,Talbot,De Neville.
Notts.Clarke;Redfearne;Treece.
Som.May;Perriman;Cox
India Kane;Felton;Cadby
London.Haysom.
Lancs.Gay.
Worcs.Coley;Mander;Sawyer.
Kings of Wessex & Scotland
Census information is Crown copyright,from
www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/

Offline jim1

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Re: 18 children by the same woman?!
« Reply #14 on: Friday 29 October 10 21:21 BST (UK) »
There's some nice pictures of the church & alter here as well.As they lived in Aston Manor all their lives I should think they walked this many times at Christenings.
http://www.astonbrook-through-astonmanor.co.uk/parishchurch

jim
Warks:Ashford;Cadby;Clarke;Clifford;Cooke Copage;Easthope;
Edmonds;Felton;Colledge;Lutwyche;Mander(s);May;Poole;Withers.
Staffs.Edmonds;Addison;Duffield;Webb;Fisher;Archer
Salop:Easthope,Eddowes,Hoorde,Oteley,Vernon,Talbot,De Neville.
Notts.Clarke;Redfearne;Treece.
Som.May;Perriman;Cox
India Kane;Felton;Cadby
London.Haysom.
Lancs.Gay.
Worcs.Coley;Mander;Sawyer.
Kings of Wessex & Scotland
Census information is Crown copyright,from
www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/

Offline littleem1906

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Re: 18 children by the same woman?!
« Reply #15 on: Saturday 30 October 10 09:50 BST (UK) »
Wow thanks everyone for all the replies! You are definately right that with a name like Smith I will need to invest in some certificates. I have the marriage certificate for Alonzo's son John and that made me want to investigate the Smith family further.

The 1871 census that you are mentioning, are we concluding that this is the same George and Clara as the 1881, 1891 census records I found?

Also the marriage to Clara Witton that Jim1 found, is this more likely than the marriage to Clara Miller that I found? It would be interesting to see what year both these women were born to determine which one was more capable of having 18 children!

How do we explain George havin a wife named Leah in 1901? Could this still be Clara? Perhaps using a middle name? Or must it be a second marriage?

I had a look on the 1911 census and these are the only 4 George Smith's I found around the same age as my George living in Birmingham;

George 1 - aged 60 married to a woman called Eliza Maria 43 and had only been married for 1 year.

George 2- aged 60, widower working as a bedstead caster. Living as a lodger to Mary Baker, aged 71 widow born in London. She has living with her a daughther Rosina Hopson, her husband William Hopson and their children, Rosina Hopson aged 6 and William Hopson aged 1.

George 3 - aged 59 married to Sarah Jane Smith for 35 years. Working as a beerhouse keeper. Have 3 duaghters, Lily, May and Alice. Can rule this one out.

George 4 - listed as George Charles Smith, aged 59, single. Living with widowed sister Mary Ann Phillips aged 64 and her 2 children Reginald George and Annie Louise.

So unless George 2 or George 2 are my George it looked like her died before 1911.

I searched for Clara in 1911 and came up with 2.

Clara 1 - aged 61, widowed living in Aston. Living with 5 children, all in their thirties or late twenties - none of the names match my Clara's children.

Clara 2 - aged 60, single. Occupation 'private means'. Living with single sister Mary Ann Smith.

So it looks like there is no Clara in 1911 either, unless George had died and she had remarried.
I tried one last serach of the 1911 census for any of their younger children.

I found 1 Bertie Smith who would have been born in 1903, mine was born in about 1900 as he appears in the 1901 census. I'm guessing Bertie could be short for Albert and as the child go older he was called by his proper name, either that or he didn't make it to 1911.

I found 3 Leonard Smith's born in Aston around 1895.

Leonard 1 - born 1896 in Aston
Leonard 2 - born 1896 in Aston
Leonard 3 - born 1898 in Aston

I decided to focus on Leonard 1 and 2 and this is what I found.
Leonard 1 - parents are Harry and Minnie Smith so cannot be my Leonard.
Leonard 2 - parents are Henry and Anna Smith so cannot be my Leonard.

Frustrating!!
Warwickshire, Birmingham, Worcestershire, Shropshire, Bridgnorth.

Online carol8353

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Re: 18 children by the same woman?!
« Reply #16 on: Saturday 30 October 10 10:09 BST (UK) »

How do we explain George havin a wife named Leah in 1901? Could this still be Clara? Perhaps using a middle name? Or must it be a second marriage?


I think that was just a case of the enumerator getting his knickers in a twist when copying out so many names- the eldest daughter was called Leah and he just copied the name across wrongly.If we ever got the chance to view the householders copies of the census forms I bet George had actually completed it(or maybe he got confused too LOL!!) correctly.

Carol
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Offline littleem1906

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Re: 18 children by the same woman?!
« Reply #17 on: Saturday 30 October 10 10:21 BST (UK) »
You're right, I can't see George marrying again.

Also my message above about the 1911 census has now been cleared up as the family have been found in 1911. So it looks like George and Clara were still alive in 1911 with a 19th child, George born in 1905! Looks like Clara had had enough by 1905 and stopped having children after this.

George is listed in this census as being born in Bedfordshire again so it looks most likely that this was his place of birth. George G Smith born 1852, Clara C Smith born 1854. I'm confused as to why they have 2 daughters called Leah, must be a typo.

Warwickshire, Birmingham, Worcestershire, Shropshire, Bridgnorth.