Hannah DAVIS

[Ripper]

I told you this was a 'funny' family
I'm working on the Tipples family at the moment to see if I can find any connections. It would be great if Ann & Sarah were sisters, nothing on the IGI to help, think I need someone with access to Totnes parish records. I'll also try to find out Sarah's maiden name
I'll mail later with any results
Fingers crossed!

[groom]

I don't think there is a connection as William Tipple was born in Norfolk and Sarah Tipple was born in Braintree Essex. Therefore neither are likely to be siblings to either William Williams or Ann Williams.

I think this is William Tipple's marriage:

June quarter 1860
William Tipple
Sarah Ann Smith
Gravesend 2a 441

This would fit as they were in Gravesend in the 1861 census. Sarah may either have been married before or had an illegitimate daughter as there is a Sarah Tipple aged 10 with them described as William's foster daughter. They also have a son William aged 4 who was born before they married.
By 1881 they have moved to Holburn and have their son, his wife and grandchildren with them. The Williams boys who were with them in 1871 are not there. 

Jan

[Ripper]

The only thing I've discovered is that they lived less than half a mile from the Williams family, and the house is up for sale at £176,000!
I suspect they we just friends though the fathers occupations were not related. OK they may have met in the pub.
Also, this William Austin if he is her son, why were they in Hospital together, I know there was a cholera outbreak in London about this time. It's interesting to see that there were lots of children with a parent.
Liza

[groom]

Hi Liza

I've found this birth, it might be worth looking at for Elizabeth

Elizabeth Williams
Sept quarter 1838
Shoreditch 2 315

It says in a census that she was born Hoxton Middlesex and this is a sub district of Shoreditch, so the date and place look correct.

Jan

[Ripper]

Thank you Jan, I'll get it ordered
Now.......if you could find the marriage!
Thanks again
Liza

[groom]

I think we are wasting our time looking for the marriage at the moment as it is likely to be before Sept 1837 when registration started. Hopefully Elizabeth's will be the right certificate and that will give us her mother's maiden name and we can go from there. It seems strange that none of the children were registered or baptised.

I'll keep my fingers crossed and wait to hear from you when you get the certificate.

Jan

[LizzieL]

Hi
I came across this thread during a surname search for Tipple (my surname interest). William Tipple was from Bressingham in Norfolk and went first to Milton, Kent and then to London. I think the marriage record you quote is correct. I do not know whether Sarah Ann was previously married and Smith is her first husband's surname, or is her maiden name - I suspect the latter. William Tipple has a son also called William born in 1857. As I can't find a previous marriage and death record for a first wife, I conclude that he is a biological son, but not legitimate. Although a few loose ends, I would agree that there is unlikely to be a family connection between the Tipples and the Williams.

If you look closely at the scan of the census record for 1871, there is a missing schedule number in the 1st column, indicating that schedule 277 was the form filled in by the Williams brothers. There is a single slash mark by Elizabeth Tipple's name, indicating division between households and a double slash mark after the youngest  Williams denoting that the next entry is a separate dwelling. If Mrs Williams was temporarily away from home, it would be the son's responsibility to complete the census form (or supply information to the enumerator). They would still consider their mother her as head of household and therefore their relationship would be her sons - hence recording "sons" on the form. I have come across a lot of cases where the breadwinner was away from home for work and the family recording their relationship to the absent head.

I don't think there is a connection as William Tipple was born in Norfolk and Sarah Tipple was born in Braintree Essex. Therefore neither are likely to be siblings to either William Williams or Ann Williams.

I think this is William Tipple's marriage:

June quarter 1860
William Tipple
Sarah Ann Smith
Gravesend 2a 441

This would fit as they were in Gravesend in the 1861 census. Sarah may either have been married before or had an illegitimate daughter as there is a Sarah Tipple aged 10 with them described as William's foster daughter. They also have a son William aged 4 who was born before they married.
By 1881 they have moved to Holburn and have their son, his wife and grandchildren with them. The Williams boys who were with them in 1871 are not there. 

Jan

[Ripper]

Thank you LizzieL, that makes sense.
Liza