Author Topic: Greensleeves Scavenger Hunt...Everyone Welcome To Join In  (Read 24680 times)

Offline youngtug

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Re: Greensleeves Scavenger Hunt...Everyone Welcome To Join In
« Reply #18 on: Tuesday 04 January 11 15:07 GMT (UK) »
The PRs may have the fact that a person baptised or buried was an inmate of the workhouse. Myself I can see no mention of Alice being an inmate, the only mention of the workhouse is that Robert was a governor of that institution. I think it is a red herring, but will need to be checked if possible. Always the possibilty that Alice had an affair or some such and became pregnant, and Robert, certain it was not his could have thrown her out, thereby she might have ended up in the workhouse. This is all conjecture, nothing as far as I can see to say she was in the workhouse.
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Offline Lesanne

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Re: Greensleeves Scavenger Hunt...Everyone Welcome To Join In
« Reply #19 on: Tuesday 04 January 11 15:30 GMT (UK) »
Ok.. quick while it's still in my head...

   Illegitimate.. If the wife had died prior to the baptism (3/4 days) Robert would be a widow and no longer married. Making the baptism out of wedlock and Illegitimate....
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Offline Spidermonkey

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Re: Greensleeves Scavenger Hunt...Everyone Welcome To Join In
« Reply #20 on: Tuesday 04 January 11 15:58 GMT (UK) »
But the child would have been born in wedlock - you wouldn't call someone who has lost a parent illegitimate, I don't think.


I think it is more likely that the parish clerk (e.g. Robert's dad) knew his daughter in law had been playing away and so decided to note his displeasure (never dreaming that in 150 years on, there would be people pondering over every nuance!)

Offline Greensleeves

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Re: Greensleeves Scavenger Hunt...Everyone Welcome To Join In
« Reply #21 on: Tuesday 04 January 11 17:03 GMT (UK) »
Hi everyone - sorry for the delay in joining you.  Will read back to catch up with what's been going on.  Much appreciate all the help!

Regards,
GS
Suffolk: Pearl(e),  Garnham, Southgate, Blo(o)mfield,Grimwood/Grimwade,Josselyn/Gosling
Durham/Yorkshire: Sedgwick/Sidgwick, Shadforth
Ireland: Davis
Norway: Torreson/Torsen/Torrison
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline toni*

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Re: Greensleeves Scavenger Hunt...Everyone Welcome To Join In
« Reply #22 on: Tuesday 04 January 11 18:17 GMT (UK) »
maybe they married after the child was conceived ???
Holman & Vinton- Cornwall, Wojciechowskyj & Hussak- Bukowiec & Zahutyn, Bentley & Richards- Leicester, Taylor-Kent/Sussex  Punnett-Sussex,  Bear/e- Monkleigh Gazey-Warwicks

UK Census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchive

Offline toni*

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Re: Greensleeves Scavenger Hunt...Everyone Welcome To Join In
« Reply #23 on: Tuesday 04 January 11 18:18 GMT (UK) »
•   Manorial Records, after 1066 the land of England was divided into Manors granted to faithful servants of the King. These did not always correspond with the boundaries of villages, towns, parishes etc. and often had their own name.
Manorial Court Rolls these refer to two types of court, Baron Court & Lett Court the latter tends to deal with law and order, on the other hand Court Baron is concerned with recording those who held land from the manor. 
(Manorial) Rental, listing all the tenants in a manor their holdings and how much they paid in rent to the manor. copyhold (now called leasehold 19th c) if you lived in or owned a house that technically came under the Manor  upon death or any over reason for the property being passed to another party even down the family line you would have to apply to the lord of the manor to do so and his consent would have to be given – even in wills (these should be  recorded in the Manor estate documents and possibly the court rolls)
Manorial Accounts recorded the income and expenditure of the manor though these generally do not contain personal names.
Manorial Documents were written in Latin until 1733.
Holman & Vinton- Cornwall, Wojciechowskyj & Hussak- Bukowiec & Zahutyn, Bentley & Richards- Leicester, Taylor-Kent/Sussex  Punnett-Sussex,  Bear/e- Monkleigh Gazey-Warwicks

UK Census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchive

Offline toni*

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Re: Greensleeves Scavenger Hunt...Everyone Welcome To Join In
« Reply #24 on: Tuesday 04 January 11 18:21 GMT (UK) »
–  Parish Rates - The Parishioners at Parish Meetings approved rated for the relief of the poor, upkeep of the church, maintenance of the roads etc. – these rates were levied according to full rents of the estates – Assessments were made out in books showing the rental value of each property in pounds and shillings and the rate payable in pounds shilling and pence – when allowed a schedule was given and signed also.
* Rate Books
put simply record money charged to and collected from householders - a form of local taxation.
to begin with they were entered into different books but later combined into general rates.
the early books are in written format but the later printed ones had entries under these headings:~
no. of property being rated
name of occupier
name of owner (which may be the occupier or not)
description of property , i.e. barns / stables/ cottage
name or situation of property (i.e. address)
the estimated area of the property expressed in yards, acres, roods and poles
the gross estimated rental
the rateable value
the amount of rate to be paid
the amount of rate collected if any.
these range from 18th century to the mid 20th century although a few exist from earlier i.e. 16th & 17th century
rate books only list the head of household sometimes by surname only
address are not always given in full
the further back you go the less detail you will find
Rate books will be held at TNA (Kew) or the Local RO
To check if anything has been transcribed in your area google
'poor rate books' 'church rate books' general rate books' etc etc
A2A will give you access to the catalogues of many respiritories search the area you want for rate book/s as the keyword with/without spaces



•   Window Tax or Light Tax was introduced in 1696 (to replace Hearth tax)  with amendments in 1747 and 1797. it was abolished in 1851.
The value to historians is the collection of names, usually of the tax-payers.
After 1784, house and window tax asesments were consolidated; they were then known asthe 'assessed taxes'. These were taxes imposed on male and female servants, carriages, carts,hair powder, horses , shops and waggons.
These assessed taxes can provide a wealth of information on the everyday and business lives of taxpayers.
The information can help, not only with names but tell the researcher whether or not an ancestor was a shop keeper, owned a horse, used hairpowder, employed servants and how many windows their house had.
Holman & Vinton- Cornwall, Wojciechowskyj & Hussak- Bukowiec & Zahutyn, Bentley & Richards- Leicester, Taylor-Kent/Sussex  Punnett-Sussex,  Bear/e- Monkleigh Gazey-Warwicks

UK Census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchive

Offline toni*

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Re: Greensleeves Scavenger Hunt...Everyone Welcome To Join In
« Reply #25 on: Tuesday 04 January 11 18:23 GMT (UK) »
was the child bp. as an adult in which case it possibly is not Roberts sons but Alices from a first marriage but bp in his name to enable him to inherit or something ?
Holman & Vinton- Cornwall, Wojciechowskyj & Hussak- Bukowiec & Zahutyn, Bentley & Richards- Leicester, Taylor-Kent/Sussex  Punnett-Sussex,  Bear/e- Monkleigh Gazey-Warwicks

UK Census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchive

Offline Greensleeves

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Re: Greensleeves Scavenger Hunt...Everyone Welcome To Join In
« Reply #26 on: Tuesday 04 January 11 18:41 GMT (UK) »
Thanks for all that, Toni - I will go through it in a mo.

First, just to clarify, Robert Junior and Alice married at St Hilda's, Hartlepool on 10 Jan 1785.  I got this from Durham Records Online.  The entry doesn't state whether Alice was single or a widow, but I agree that at her age it is likely that this was a second marriage.  The record does state the witnesses' named - William Burrell and Ann Coulson, so I am wondering if either or both of them were related to Alice.

But the marriage date shows that she and Robert had been married for just over three years when William was born in March 1788.

  Hmm, just a thought - if Alice  was married before and husband disappeared, she remarried and then Husband No 1 returned, that presumably would make baby William illegitimate....  But it wouldn't explain why the PR states  "illegitimate son of Robert Shadforth (junr) and Alice (his wife)..."
Suffolk: Pearl(e),  Garnham, Southgate, Blo(o)mfield,Grimwood/Grimwade,Josselyn/Gosling
Durham/Yorkshire: Sedgwick/Sidgwick, Shadforth
Ireland: Davis
Norway: Torreson/Torsen/Torrison
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk