Where were these construction workers in London, when photographed?

[Jean McGurn]

In which case if not underground railway what about underground toilets? I seem to recall seeing some in London but can't recall where.

Otherwise what else would need such large strong beams?

Jean

[Redroger]

Without going into too much detail I can tell you that the works are nothing at all to do with railways.

railways. 

The only connec tion I implied with railways was that the supporting beams may have had earlier service as railway track supports; sleepers in the UK, ties in North America.

[Marengo]

In which case if not underground railway what about underground toilets? I seem to recall seeing some in London but can't recall where.

Otherwise what else would need such large strong beams?

Jean

I am separated from this job by not only a century or so but by the  physical tyranny of 19 000 kilometres. So, although having some engineering background, I hold back from appearing too authoritative.
However, I would make these suggestions:
I am struck by the complete absence of tools - apart from the ladder.
I don't think any of the  pictured timber is permanent. The supporting beams certainly aren't - they're well above road level.
I think the two capstan screws merely suspend the formwork decking (planking beneath their feet) from the crossbeams.
It is possible that the work (which I would guess would probably be sewerage) is fairly much done and that it has all taken place below their feet, under the decking.
Wouldn't it be nice if there was a readi-mix truck just waiting around the corner ready  to pour concrete on top of that planking. Then we could take all that timber away underneath, leaving a beautifully strong lid, just under street level. Then we could stop bothering that music teacher with all our dust and blasphemy.

PS. That great grandad of mine from Limerick (below), swears they're digging for gold.

[youngtug]

In which case if not underground railway what about underground toilets? I seem to recall seeing some in London but can't recall where.

Otherwise what else would need such large strong beams?

Jean

I am separated from this job by not only a century or so but by the  physical tyranny of 19 000 kilometres. So, although having some engineering background, I hold back from appearing too authoritate.
However, I would make these suggestions:
I am struck by the complete absence of tools - apart from the ladder.
I don't think any of the  pictured timber is permanent. The supporting beams certainly aren't - they're well above road level.
I think the two capstan screws merely suspend the formwork decking (planking beneath their feet from the crossbeams).
It is possible that the work (which I would guess would probably be sewerage) is fairly much done and that it has all taken place below their feet, under the decking.
Wouldn't it be nice if there was a readi-mix truck just waiting around the corner ready  to pour concrete on top of that planking. Then we could take all that timber away underneath, leaving a beautifully strong lid, just under street level. Then we could stop bothering that music teacher with all our dust and blasphemy.

See reply 42

[toni*]

Not much to add here as this thread has been going on for a while and the location and date is solved however immediately behind Edward Gatfield is a ladder which is obscuring the music school name thus pertaining the work was under the level where the men are standing they wouldn’t need  ladder access  into that trench where they are standing

The children are dressed in what I would call 1910’s clothes and one boy is on a bicycle

The spindle things are called winches my granddad used to turn one when opening the swingbridge where I live this has now been replaced with an electric version

I also spotted the Simons sign but could read what it said and thought maybe it was an estate agents sign! Lol

Finally the man in the centre with the bowler hat and the man standing on the beam behind him on the building in between the two there are some white things on the windows

[nigelp]

Hi Toni,

I don't think the date is solved. There are different views as to whether the photo was, say, about 1905-6  or 1910-12.

Nigel

[Redroger]

Having just had another look at the picture, I realised those cross beams are much too long to have ever been railway sleepers.

[Phodgetts]

Well, right or wrong I am going to let you in on what I have found out thus far about what MIGHT be going on in this street view.

I am now convinced that the works are associated with the development and extension of the sewers and storm water drains across London. Flooding had been an issue for a good number of years. One of the problems being that storm water could not drain into the Thames from low lying areas at high water. The solution proposed circa 1897 was to construct relief drains and sewers to compliment what was already there. Also additional pumping stations were to be built to raise the storm waters up and above high water mark enabling the storm water to be pumped into the river and prevent flooding. Work commenced in 1901 and continued until the project was finished in 1906. In this instance the storm drain was purely that and only (clean) rainwater would have passed through it. The map I will attach shows 'clean' drains in green and 'dirty' drains (sewers) in red.

I came across a map (dated 1930) that shows one of the relief drains in exactly the location we are discussing. It is identified as the High Level Relief Storm Drain. I will attach a cropped and highlighted section of that map.

I also found an online book about the sewers and drains that makes for interesting reading if you feel like digging (no pun intended  ) a little deeper for yourselves.

Link to the map;    http://www.sewerhistory.org/images/bm/bmm3/1930_bmm315.jpg

Link to the book;   http://www.sewerhistory.org/articles/whregion/1930_abm1/index.htm

Hope you enjoying piecing it together. It is certainly fascinating.

Referring back to the large timber beams laid across the works, I believe that they would have been used to shore up the sides of what would have been a very deep trench. I think that timbers will line the trench and the winding mechanism perhaps is used to keep the shoring pressed tight against the side of the trench providing a safe and protected work environment for the navvies.

P 

[ShaunJ]

I just checked the 1908 PO Directory - which was presumably compiled in 1907.

Solomon Simons, cabinet maker, was still in Shoreditch. There is no listing for 113 Mare Street.