George GOODMAN

[bgoodman]

Once again thank you Maddie. I noticed in some of the census that there were some Goodman family members at Mill End. If I recall correctly some were named James, Joseph etc and I must admit I did wonder about any connection there with my Goodman family. I found a religious census return for 1851 "The one holy Catholic and apostle Church" at Mill End Rickmansworth. I wrote to the Catholic family History expert Michael Gandy who surprised me by saying that this place of worship would not have been Roman Catholic. He thought it was probably protestant in origin. With the name Henry Goodman I noticed in one of the Rickmansworth directories and also the census that there was a baker called Henry Goodman. He may have appeared in later census. Not sure if he is connected to you in any way.

[1783caz]

Hi there ...yes you were correct George 1844 is the son of James blacksmith ....
Do you know the mothers names of your senior George ? Just incase i stumble upon anything ...
I was reading something other day about an orphanage that moved down from London due to typhus outbreak in 1871 ...it relocated in watford and renamed itself "London Orphan School" it then evacuated and moved again to surrey by WW2...not sure if its of any help ?

[bgoodman]

My memory is not good at the best of times. Sorry about that Ray. Besides a possibility of a canal connection I was also wondering about a brewery connection. I noticed that the younger Elizabeth Winfield had a father who was a master brewer. Thinking of the George who lodged at the bear in 1861 who may or may not be my relative. There was a James Goodman in Wargrave who appeared to own a pub also. He was the one who had the son George 1848 who I wondered about. He left a will which is with the National Archives and it appeared he died in 1848. I also read that Goodman and Slater were mentioned re the brewery connection at Rickmansworth. Although it was mentioned that on reflection this could have been written in error. Just little snippets of information that got me thinking.

[bgoodman]

Thank you for that. With George senior the only info that I do have is that his father was called James and that info came from his marriage cert. I have no idea if he had any brothers or sisters or even what his mother's name was. I just know that he said twice that he was born in Ricky in 1871 at enlistment and in the 1881 census. I have come across that London Orphanage information before and it is now an impressive residential place in orphanage road Watford. There was another place in Rickmansworth although I am unable to recall exactly where at present.A member of the founder's family has posted information on the internet about it. I can see that you are indeed working hard covering a lot of ground at present. Do you know if you had any relatives in Devon re the person's family who has agreed to be DNA tested.

[1783caz]

I read that about Salters and Goodman brewers ....very interesting read (esp where the landlord instructs loads of beer left outside each day for the locals after he dies )lol ...
Have you tried to use the name "Godman " as i found one of mine in the census with that instead of "Goodman" and apparently it was a form of this name ...might be worth a try .

The george  lodging at The Bear  ...i thought could be James blacksmiths son ? ...as in 1860 James blacksmith has lost his wife Sarah and by 1861 hes been admitted to the workhouse .Sadly  Ann the youngest at 13 ends up in lodgings in uxbridge and i can only find a teenage George at the bear .

Your deffo right i have been working flat out on all this ...its all so interesting .
Im not sure about Devon but i do know from recent contact with other Goodmans on my tree theres some in Cornwall and a recent one in Somerset ...although it could be quite possible as the furthest goodman i have who is the Blacksmiths father Thomas Goodman born 1771 was from Rushall Wiltshire originaly (not far from Devon  )...i dont know who his parents are or any siblings or anything ...so im not sure if he created all this in Rickmansworth by himself or wether he was accompanied by his family too ? lol.
It is one of the next things i need to find out as i think its game over for me if i dont .

[[Ray]]

Hi

Some "odd" snippets . . . . .

Orphanage = Reeds                 
http://www.mpritchard.com/reeds.php

and . . . . . (1880)
"In the neighbourhood of Rickmansworth are several Hamlets. At BATCHWORTH, to the south, are extensive Paper mills. At FROGMORE HOUSE, in this Hamlet, an Orphan Home for fifty poor girls, was established by Mr. Joseph Stephenson, and is supported by voluntary contributions."

"Beer left outside pub" = Coach & Horses (Rickmansworth)
http://www.thecoachandhorses.info/history.htm
(Wonderful pub!)
Also says "Salter&Woodman" not Goodman ?!?!

The church between Rickmansworth and Croxley Green
was a maltings before the church frontage was added
http://www.rickmansworthcatholicchurch.org/churchhistory.htm

1820 The Brewhouse at the Gorrells, west of Bury Lane, closed.
1889 Foundation stone laid for Salters High Street brewery

... and of course Uxbridge is on the canal 


Ray

[bgoodman]

Yes that is it Ray, Frogmore house, thank you. I was just pondering on that name today but you saved me the job of looking it up again. Although I can recall that I didn't find any Goodman on the list of names. However I feel that it is good to discuss the existence of these places as it may be helpful to someone in their research. Re the barrel of ale, I saw a victorian display at the Watford Museum some years ago and read a beautiful sad poem re the problem with alcohol and the poorer families. When later reading about the free ale in Rickmansworth it made me wonder if it didn't add to the problem in Rickmansworth in particular. I also read that the brewery had to stop as the gesture was eventually abused by the public and became a problem for the town. Now that you mentioned the name associated with Slater should be Woodman any connection with the Wargrave Goodman and Rickmansworth's pubs, such as the bear and brewery seems unlikely.

[bgoodman]

Hi 1783Caz thanks for looking out for stuff for me. I remember reading in Watford Reference Library some years ago about Goodman- Watford /Rickmansworth militia history. I have a feeling that further up your tree there may be an Abraham also. Thomas was mentioned and a reference made to son and father, not sure  which was which though. It was quite far back as some of the spelling was old English style. Trouble is I got rid of a lot of my notes when I eventually found George senior's regiment. When I first started looking at my history Watford kept the very old local books in a locked cabinet which you were not permitted to photocopy. Although in latter years they had to deposit them with Hertford Archives. Quite a lot of stuff has now been transcribed I believe. 

[1783caz]

ah bless you thanks for info  :0
i realy do hope you find your george ...ive yet to fill in all the branches of kids on my grandparents tree ....ive recently found out my william joseph was infact a joseph william he  swapped his name round ( crafty little so n so lol ) and his younger brother was a joseph but died soon after birth ..so the parents may of named my william after his dead brother and he swapped it about ....i deffo know now there was a thomas father to george 1844 ...and james 1832 =george henry = joseph= joseph + jospeh william .

i think it will be about 2 weeks time till i start looking at other people off my proper line ...it depends on what info i get back from wiltshire ...but im keeping your notes just incase ..... to see how long youve been doing this for and me 1 month and ive now got loads ..its quite heart wrenching with all the work you have put into it to not have many leads ....very interesting case ...im not going to make it to watford today ...postpone till next week ...( shattered from whipsnade zoo yest lol ) but i will deffo look out for your george and enquire when i eventualy attend ....we have to find him .!!!