Francis

[KenS]

Hi.   Yep. Isaac b.1852 was my grt grandfather. He married Sarah Ellen Herron 23rd March 1878.  John Herron b.1831 was her father.   Isaac (bro to Mary Ann) had a son called Isaac -who died in WW1 1916 -he never saw my father Isaac b 1916.       Going back to Henry - Elemore Wood is where he hung himself.  Alice died having had bronchitis for 10 days aged 65. on Boxing day 1878.

I had Mary Ann down as married in Dec 1852.   

[hallmark]

Ahhh....  Church of Ireland!

[dhowse]

I have 344 dna matches on ancestry that interconnect with this family. Many descend from a group who left Durham and went to America in the mid 1850s. Some are still living the gypsy lifestyle.
Most connect through the Smith side and just a few through the Francis.
There are some of us in Australia and quite a few still in Britain.

[dhowse]

I have Mary Ann Smith born about 1835 married 21 sep 1861 Kelloe to Robert Johnson, pitman

[KenS]

Hi.
You are correct.   FreeBDM
Marriages Sep 1861   (>99%)    Mary Ann Smith
Johnson    Robert        Easington    10a   366    

Someone contacted me saying Henry Smith`s father was a William Smith, from outside of Dublin, however they have failed to come back to me about where they got this information. Shame.
 

[dhowse]

Hi Ken
I have Henry’s father as William and that information probably came originally from me. It is speculative. Both Henry and William live near each other in Durham. I have Multipledna matches to descendants of both William and Henry. A shared dna match in America had a dna match to a Smith in London. I followed her tree back and arrived at William.
I also have dna matches that suggest that the Frances and Smith families were already connected before henry and Alice married.
Regards
Deb

[KenS]

Hi Deb. 
The source told me about their link with DNA and an Aussie connection.   What makes you think William IS Henry`s father?   I have found no link which suggests William is anywhere near Henry.   On one census Henry states he was born in Michaels Town, Limerick - this is probably Michaelstown, County Cork, which is on the border with Limerick.  So I was bit dumfounded to read William was in Dublin area.  Love to know the reasoning or evidence which suggests William is near Henry.   Henry did have a son called William(Billy) b.1834.  Not specifically traced him as found 2 William Smiths who died 1884 -Whilst in the Workhouse or 1857 -Murton Colliery (although no record of a death at the colliery at that date).     I did visit the area of Henry`s suicide last year, and the well where he was last seen by a young girl at 7am is still there.     Ps.  Love Aussie land...Ken

[dhowse]

Hi Ken
My subscription not current with ancestry so I am having a bit of trouble bringing up the information from the census.
I haveWilliam Smith in 1841 in hetton le hole and in 1851 in easington.
He had remarried late in life and had more children to a very young wife.
I have him as born Newry, Ireland but note that many of these travelling families vary their place of birth significantly on different census.
My mother has 554 dna matches to people who interconnect. They have the names Smith, Francis, Mullen, Wharton, Boswell among others in their families.
Some appear to be descendants of William Smith born 1790. He appears to have arrived in the north of England about the same time as Henry. On one census they live very near each other. Both have the same occupation.
Many of the interconnecting dna matches lead to Henry Smith and Alice Francis. Particularly a group that left Durham in the mid 1850 s and travelled across America. some of this group have only given up travelling within the last generation.
Have you a dna test I could check for a match against?

Regards
Deb

[KenS]

Hi Deb.
No DNA. Although the wifey might pay for one for my birthday!!!   I can track easily back to Henry`s son Isaac b.1852. my grt,grt grandad. (He died 1894 Diabetis Mellitus with Henry his brother as informant)(and Isaac was present at Alice`s death 1878).  I have the 1841 census, can`t see another Smith on the street in Hetton(Easington) and part of the 1851 census no show there either.  Shall have to investigate further.   Do you have the wedding certificate of Henry/Alice? Just a thought that William might show as a witness.   Do you have the coroners report on Henry`s suicide (I have it)?
Shame about Henry`s daughter Joanna who got crushed by wagons (1851) just wonder if that was another reason apart from his Lyme disease that made him commit suicide.   All interesting...Ken