Author Topic: 1911 Census reference to Edward WILLIAMS - born in Ireland  (Read 3266 times)

Offline peterghwilliams

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1911 Census reference to Edward WILLIAMS - born in Ireland
« on: Thursday 05 May 11 13:49 BST (UK) »
Can you please help me to get started on tracing my grandfather Edward WILLIAMS?
From his address of 145 Askew Road , London in the 1911 Census  he was born in Ireland circa 1866.
His  place of birth "appears" to read as Kildulcon.  I am unable to find this place or anything similar.
Any help would be much appreciated.
Thank you,
Peter Williams

Offline shanew147

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Re: 1911 Census reference to Edward WILLIAMS - born in Ireland
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 05 May 11 14:06 BST (UK) »
unfortunately 'Kil' is a very common prefix on Irish placenames - it's means church in Irish. You can check a database of townlands in Ireland at www.thecore.com/seanruad   I had a quick look but didn't see anything close..

Have you found Edward on any other census returns ?

see :  Introduction to Irish Records
         My Ancestor came from Ireland - where do I start?   


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Offline shanew147

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Re: 1911 Census reference to Edward WILLIAMS - born in Ireland
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 05 May 11 14:43 BST (UK) »
Do you have marriage details for Edward ?

His father's name might help locate a possible birth match of the extracted births collection on familysearch. This collection includes more details than the BMD index for many births in Ireland between 1864 and about 1881 - but is not complete, and does not include all districts.

There's a number of possible matches for Edward's birth here : births of Edward Williams - 1865 to 1867


Shane
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Offline KGarrad

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Re: 1911 Census reference to Edward WILLIAMS - born in Ireland
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 05 May 11 14:51 BST (UK) »
It sure does look like "Kildulcon"!


Moderator Note - cropped the image to make it easier to see..
Garrad (Suffolk, Essex, Somerset), Crocker (Somerset), Vanstone (Devon, Jersey), Sims (Wiltshire), Bridger (Kent)


Offline Bockety

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Re: 1911 Census reference to Edward WILLIAMS - born in Ireland
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 05 May 11 20:28 BST (UK) »
I suppose he could have forgotten exactly what it was called 45 years later.

Dulcon sounds like Dolcáin and Cluain Dolcáin or Clondalkin ( now a suburb of Dublin ) is where that is.  Mixing up a Clon and Kil wouldn't faze an Irishman.  :D

Celbridge is quite near , even had a direct railway between them ( around one stop ) in 1866

https://www.familysearch.org/search/recordDetails/show?uri=https://api.familysearch.org/records/pal:/MM9.1.r/93TH-RS6/p1

Maybe his dad was scuttered celebrating the birth and got it wrong, forever. Maybe his dad was scuttered and the registrar was deaf.

There is a Kilduncan in Scotland, somewhere in Fife near St Andrews Golf Course. Have you checked against that?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fife





Offline peterghwilliams

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Re: 1911 Census reference to Edward WILLIAMS - born in Ireland
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 05 May 11 21:02 BST (UK) »
Thank you all very much for the very fast replies, extracts & info.
Certainly still looking for inspiration!!!
I do have Edward WILLIAMS marriage details but unfortunately his father is  shown as deceased with no name & occupation NK.
He married Annie KING in August 1912 in Fulham, London.
So far I have not been able to trace him through a previous Census.
Thanks,
Peter Williams
 

Offline MariaB

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Re: 1911 Census reference to Edward WILLIAMS - born in Ireland
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 05 May 11 22:15 BST (UK) »
If his memory played tricks on him, could he have meant Killucan or Kilcullen?

MariaB

Offline peterghwilliams

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Re: 1911 Census reference to Edward WILLIAMS - born in Ireland
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 05 May 11 22:46 BST (UK) »
Thanks, -  from an old postcard dated July 1912 I believe  he was in a large Convalescent Home  in Walton on Thames.
Any ways of linking into this fact ?????
Thanks,
Peter W

Offline Bockety

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Re: 1911 Census reference to Edward WILLIAMS - born in Ireland
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 05 May 11 23:00 BST (UK) »
One thing that is oft forgotten is the diversity of dialects/pronounciation within Ireland and not forgetting that Ireland ceased to be Irish speaking largely between 1850 and 1900...but that prononciations were important in anglicising.

Were the parent following Irish prononciation then their original dialect would play a part and that would be received by the offspring. EG Limerick City NE county and Scouse dialects share the same (mis)prononciation of "R"

There is a Kildalkin near Clondalkin , proof

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Kildalkin-Athletic-Youths/123461944750#!/pages/Kildalkin-Athletic-Youths/123461944750?sk=info who give their address as Baldonnel ( next door)

But the local dialect is not muttteral/gutteral...only someone in Galway/Mayo could effortlessly turn Kildalkin into Kildulcon to be frank.

However in a failed attempt to sound posh a la southern england it would be possible at least to MY inner ear.

As Kildalkin and Clondalkin were rural I have no idea where the births would be registered.

Kildalkin would not be an 'official' townland . It would officially be called something else. It is located around here

http://maps.osi.ie/publicviewer/#V1,704679,729992,4,10

Click the Historic 6" layer to get the official townland names that would have been in the Griffith Valuation which is arecord of who lived where 1850-1860 so they could be taxed.

Problem is that his mother or father would be recorded...not him. Good news is names run in families except that Queen Vic had a sprog called "Edward" around then :)

Match Williams to the right official townland, there were loads of them in County Dublin so ya gotta dig

http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml


A Mr Joe Williams is BIG in the Clondalkin Historical Society :D Ya never knows.

http://www.southdublinhistory.ie/Clondalkin/clondalkin_biblio.htm