East Middle Cavers Kirktown Scott Blyth Muir

[janeli_1]

This question pertains to a small branch of my family tree.  My 2x great grandmother, Elizabeth Scott was born in Scotland ..... I am pretty sure Roxburghshire.   She emigrated to Canada where she married my 2x great grandfather.  She was born or baptised Aug 9 1803.  I haven't yet found the record.  She died 1884 in Canada.    The information I have is that her parents were John Scott and Nancy Blythe.  No information re John Scott but Nancy's parents were unknown Blythe and unknown Muir. 

I have done a lot of searching and today I believe I have the correct John Scott and Nancy Blyth married or banns 13 April 1801 in Kirktown Roxburgh.  The record of marriage is at the bottom of a page and the last sentence is illegible,  What I can read is: John Scott in Cavers parish and Nancy Blyth in East Middle in this parish ...........I can't read the rest.   On Scotlandspeople I find Kirkton (Roxburgh) as a parish in the county of Roxburgh and it is the one listed on the site for the marriage record. 

I have tried searching for Nancy Blyth's birth record and may never find it.   I recently learned that Jessie was a nickname for Janet and am now wondering if Nancy is a nickname (or was) for Agnes or even for Ann.  I realize the birth may not have been recorded but it was it usual to record baptisms in the church I think.  I am beginning to suspect the mother's name 'Muir' may be incorrect.

I have had good success finding births and marriages for many but deaths/burials have been a challenge.  Might they simply not have been recorded?

Main question:  Could Nancy have been born Agnes? I found an Agnes Blyth born the right time in East Middle but wrong mother.  Maybe Muir was step-mother?  If her death is recorded it would been only under her married name??

Any help is aprreciated,
Thanks 
Jan

[alan14578]

Jannelli .If you do a family search with AGNES Blyth you will find 6 children born Cavers no Elizabeth but an Agnes George James Thomas Betty and Isabel. There is also family record ancestral file with all the details. Certaily the marriage shows Nancy nut the dirths show Agnes! I cant find a death for her in any name.

[janeli_1]

Jannelli .If you do a family search with AGNES Blyth you will find 6 children born Cavers no Elizabeth but an Agnes George James Thomas Betty and Isabel. There is also family record ancestral file with all the details. Certaily the marriage shows Nancy nut the dirths show Agnes! I cant find a death for her in any name.

Hi,  thanks for your reply.   I don't think the info is enough for proof yet but every hint is a help.
I need to know if Nancy was a nickname for another  birth name.  I have found some nicknames unusual to me.
I feel confident that i have found the right marriage record.  based on it, I believe Nancy Blyth(e) was most likely born in Kirktown ( East Middle) rather than Cavers, although the family could have moved.   John Scott seems to be from Cavers, though.
I am still trying to locate their daughter's birth record. 
Thanks for your input  and I will keep at it!

Jan

[barbara13511]

Yes Jan,
Agnes can be Nancy, Nan, Ann, Nanny.  I have seen all these as diminutives of Agnes.
But the marriage only means they resided in that parish at the time of marriage, not necessarily that they came from there originally.
Barbara

[janeli_1]

Yes Jan,
Agnes can be Nancy, Nan, Ann, Nanny.  I have seen all these as diminutives of Agnes.
But the marriage only means they resided in that parish at the time of marriage, not necessarily that they came from there originally.
Barbara

Thanks, Barbara.  I wondered also about Ann.  I realize the location of the wedding is only where the bride lived at the time of the wedding but as many people moved little it seemed a good place to start.  I will see what i can find in Roxburgh using Ann and Agnes as well as Nancy. 

Thanks so very much for the information about the nickname Nancy ........... a really big help

Can you tell me anything about East Middle?  Is it a village in the parish of Kirktown/Kirkton?

Thanks again

Jan

[barbara13511]

HI Jan

East Middle is nearer Cavers than Kirkton on my map.  It is between Cavers and Denholm and near Cavers Mains.  Try Scotlandsplaces for a map?

http://www.scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/search/index.php?action=do_search&id=644&p_name=CAVERS&p_type=PARISH&p_county1=Roxburghshire

Barbara

[MonicaL]

Jan, to help you with your future puzzles on first names and variants! This is my favourite site for variants www.whatsinaname.net/php/search.php?action=search2&search_name=agnes (using Agnes as an example). The site has a strong Scottish bias which helps a lot 

Monica

[janeli_1]

Thanks Barbara and Monica!  I was about to share my findings when i saw two new posts!  I will look at the sites you recommend.  I have a very simple map of parishes of Roxburgh which helps general picture for me. 

I searched first on IGI.  Nothing works for Ann.  Nancy seems an odd per name for Agnes so I am glad I asked.  I found three baptisms for Agnes Blyth.  One would have her married at 13 yrs so I can dump that one but wanted a wide range.  I found one for Ancrum and she would have been 17 and 1/2 so very possible.  the 3rd reasonable one is for Wilton and she would have been married at 24 yrs.  I searched for her early enough to be a second marriage at 45 yrs but she wouldn't have given birth likely.

So either 17 or 24 yrs at marriage ..... both reasonable.    Barbara, according to my map and your East Middle, either seems possible.  I think I have enough to head to scotlandspeople now!

Monica, the name variants will help in other parts of my family.  I have lots of ancestors all over the border counties!  Even if i can never prove it, I can include the 2 written options on my tree.   I am enjoying, anyway!

Thanks so very much Barbara and Monica for your input!

Jan

[janeli_1]

Barbara and Monica,
I have done a lot of searching.  The "names" site is exceptional!  I also have an ancestor whose sister was Grisel (Grace).  Now I understand how others concluded she was the same person.   I learned quite a lot from the maps but never did find East Middle.  I can see the Parishes are small.

I have exhausted IGI and Scotlandspeople.  I did find a record on IGI for an Agnes Blyth baptised before 1790 in East Middle and married to John Scott abt 1801.  I am assuming the abt 1801 is because the record I found was banns (13 Apr 1801).  The person who recorded the information made the same assumption I did about east Middle as birth place.

Anyway, with all my searching, I had forgotten that Nancy's mother was supposed to be a Muir.   The baptism in Wilton had a mother ...Isabel Reid whereas the baptism in Ancrum has no mother named.

I know I can't prove it likely but does this sound reasonable:

Nancy Blythe was born Agnes Blyth and baptised on 24 Oct 1783 in Ancrum.   Probably born about 1 Oct 1783.   Banns read in Kirktown 13 Apr 1801.   Marriage perhaps later in April or in May.  Nancy (Agnes) would have been 17 1/2 when married.

I don't think being married before 18 would have been unusual.    Is baptism in Ancrum, growing up in Kirktown and meeting husband in Cavers reasonable?

I think I just may have it!!

Thanks so much,

Jan