british army involvement in russian civil war 1919

[dfss]

Senior members of my family tell me that my Grandfather who served throughout the First World War was part of the British Expeditionary Force sent to aid the "Whites" during the Russian Civil War in 1919. I was wondering if records of individual units and their members were available and if so, where ?

[km1971]

Here is a link to the units taking part - http://www.1914-1918.net/northrussia.htm

As no special medals were awarded for Russia you really need to hope that your GF's service record survives on Ancestry.

Ken

[dfss]

Thanks very much Ken.....much appreciated.

[jim1]

known as "Churchill's war" or "The forgotten war" the force included Canadian's who departed to Archangel on the arrival of the British who were there to assist in training the white Russian forces under Kolchak? (I'm working from memory here) who had a provisional government supported by the west.
This force was pretty much dismissed by the Russians who the British thought were a unruly rabble anyway.
There were many letters back to the British Govt. with complaints of lack of co-operation from the Russians & the need to keep the British troops occupied.As the Bolsheviks advanced the international community under kolchak's protection fled with pratically all they could carry.In some instances the Boleshik's were entering one end of a city while the western Eoropeans were leaving at the other.
The British Govt. pulled out late 1919 partly because they could see that Kolchak was going to lose & also the escapade had cost the taxpayer over £49,000,000 at a time when Britain was practically bankrupt.
I have a relative who died there in June 1919 & there is a memorial stone to him & 12 other British & Canadian soldiers who died there.

jim

[jim1]

From the War Graves Commission:
The 37 British War Graves at Vladivostok, and the 13 names on the Vladivostok Memorial, are due to the period of confusion in Siberia which followed the Treaty of Brest Litovsk. The establishment of a Siberian (anti-Bolshevik) Republic in December 1917 (and of other Republics in Siberia a little later) was followed by the march of the Czechoslovak Divisions in the Russian service from Poland eastwards, and in particular by the arrival of the 2nd Czechoslovak Division at Valdivostok in May 1918. The Japanese Government had sent a small detachment to that port in January, 1918; British and Japanese Marines landed on the 5th April; a British battalion came in June, and another in December, and in October a stronger Canadian force had landed. The autumn fighting went in favour of the Allies and Admiral Koltchak's Government, but the tide turned in 1919. An official French statement gave the number of troops of nine Allied or Associated nations in Siberia, in March 1919, as nearly 120,000, including 55,000 Czechoslovaks; they were gradually withdrawn. The British and Japanese left in the winter of 1919; Koltchak was finally defeated on the 8th January 1920, at Krasnoyarsk; the Czechoslovaks and an American hospital evacuated Vladivostok in March 1920. The Siberian Expeditionary Force was mainly Canadian, and it included No. II Canadian Stationary Hospital and No. 16 Canadian Field Ambulance. It left the graves of 14 Canadian soldiers and 14 from the United Kingdom in Churkin Russian Naval Cemetery; those of seven sailors of the Royal Navy, one Marine and one United Kingdom soldier in the Lutheran part of Pokrovskaya Cemetery; and those of ten soldiers from the United Kingdom and three from Canada at other places in Siberia.

[jim1]

From a Canadian researcher.
Occasionally, I come across records of a soldier who served in WWI who
was sent to Vladivostok, Russia, on the Pacific coast and I've wondered
what these men were doing there. The first man I found was John Wynn
from Niagara Falls, but who perhaps had a tie to the NS Winn/Wynn
families.

This week's "Maclean's" (Magazine), Jan. 26, 2004, pp. 35/6, has a
small, but informative article by Nathan Greenfield titled: "War On
The Reds."

When the armistice was signed on Nov 11, 1918, fighting still raged along
the Eastern front with some 200,000 Allied troops in the midst of the
melee, incl. the Canadian Field Artillery fighting at Tulgas.

Mr. Greenfield explains that the reasons for their continued involvement
varied. The Allies didn't want Germany's ally, Turkey, to take control of
the oil fields on the coast of the Caspian Sea and they didn't want the
Germans to get the "materiel" that the Allied troops had sent into Russia.
On the political front, the Allies had committed themselves to helping the
White Russians during the Russian Revolution, because the eastern front
had collapsed and allowed Germany to deploy troops from the east to
battle the Allies in the west when the Red army was involved. After Nov.
11, a less than full hearted alliance continued with the White Russians.
Our troops were tired. Four years of war was enough.

In August, 1918, while prime minister Borden was in London meeting
with the War Cabinet, acting P.M., Newton Rowell, committed Canadian
troops to the cause. Already (since Jan. 14th), 41 volunteer officers
and NCO's had been deployed to Russian ports on the Pacific. The largest
contingent would include some 3,800 troops.

The article continues with interesting facts. For example, by Feb., 1919,
some 15,000 Allied troops, including 100 Canadians under Col. John
Leckie of Vancouver, were stationed in Murmansk. Leckie's men were
among the 600 who, with temperatures at -40, captured Segeza and found
seized materiel and rail cars manufactured in Nova Scotia.

I found who was sent to Vladivostok was a Nova Scotian who was first
posted to Vancouver.

Perhaps surprisingly, according to the article, only 7 Canadians were
killed in this almost invisible and mostly forgotten war that lasted until
1920. One was Captain Oliver A. Mowat of Campbellton, N.B., whose
remains were transferred home for burial.

To round out the article, Mr. Greenfield briefly outlines the political
war on Parliament Hill over whether to send these troops, or not.

[jim1]

Managed to dig out a couple of websites:
http://www.naval-history.net/WW1z05NorthRussia.htm
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0eao/
jim

[IMBER]

The British involvement in South Russia etc tends to get overlooked:

http://hubpages.com/hub/Churchills-Private-War-British-Intervention-in-South-Russia--1919

[dfss]

Hi Jim and Imber.....

Thank you so much for all this info. and leads to follow.
The training aspect of British involvement with the White Russians makes sense in my Grandfather's case. I know that he was wounded twice on the Western Front and so, at the end of the War, he was relieved from active duties in France and was involved with training fresh troops (During which he sustained another injury due to the misfunctioning of a faulty grenade !) One speculates that he might in 1919 have been assigned to new "Russian" duties.

I wish that he was still aroud to ask !

Much gratitude