1841 Census - Sophia McLAREN

[sarra]

Would some kind person, see if they can find Sophia McLaren on the 1841 census....please.

I have her on the 1851 - she is at Crichtons Close Overgate - Angus - Dundee.
With husband - James Murray - 24 - b.Ireland -  daughter Jessie - age 1.
Patrick Murray -14 - b.Ireland.
Alexander McLaren - 32 - b. Strathlay (possibly brother of Sophia)
Sophia MURRAY - 28 - b.Strathlay, Pertshire.

It's possible that Sophia's father was Alexander McLaren - undertaker......her mother Margaret.

By 1854 Sophia & James Murray are in Australia.

Appreciate it if she can be found in 1841.

Sarra

[ev]

hi Sarra 

can't see anything on the 1841 census

however there is an extracted marriage on the IGI for james murray and sophia mclaren 30th sept.1849 edinburgh midlothian
it gives her father as william mclaren

also sophia mclaren birth 16th may 1821 , baptism 19th may 1821 scottish episcopal church , kilmaveonaig , STRATHTAY and strath-tummel , perth
parents william mclaren and janet dewar

could strathlay on the 1851 census actually be strathtay 

also sophia's daughter jessie may be named after sophia's mother
(janet/jessie are interchangeable in scotland)

just a few thoughts 

ev

[sarra]

Hi Ev,

I did see that marriage on the IGI for James Murray & Sophia McLaren, I was inclined to believe, from that her father was William McLaren.

Until I got a copy Sophia's death record - it says her father was Alexander McLaren (occ - undertaker) - her mother Margaret Graham.....place of birth looks like....Aberfeld ?? .....
of course this information is only as good as the informant's knowledge.

The name Sophia does not seem to be of Scottish origins, searching through the census it does not appear very often.

I have seen that baptism in 1821 - parents William McLaren and Janet Dewar.....I'm not sure if it is my Sophia??

James & Sophia Murray had another child James b.abt 1852, their next child was Margaret b.1854 in Australia.
 
I think what I will have to do is get........Margaret's birth record - that will give me Sophia's birth place as well as date and place of marriage. That way I  will be able see where I am going.

Wherever Sophia is in 1841 she is will hidden....because I tried all ways to find her.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Sarra

[ev]

aberfeldy and strathtay are in the same area

http://www.streetmap.co.uk/

ev

[sarra]

Hi Ev,

Thanks for the link.....I think I will have to admit defeat on this one.

I downloaded the marriage record from Scotlands People.

It's rather confusing says Sophia's father was William McLaren - farmer near Scone. This marriage record was incomplete - in that it did not say, where the marriage took place or the date...also the name of the Minister. The two other marriages on the same page were filled in completely.

Many thanks for your help.

Sarra

[Cambron]

You were looking at the Marriage Banns which were published in Edinburgh for Sophia and Ayr for James Murray.
William McLaren and Janet Dewar had children in both Dull(incl Sophia)and Logierait parishes.
You will find William at 1851 in Scone under the name McLaurin with his son Robert and Granddaughter Margaret.Janet Dewar seems to have died as William's wife is given as an Ann.All other details fit.William did not register either of his marriages.
In Dull at 1841 there is a Sophy McLearen aged 6.She was born Margaret Sophia McLaren in 1836 to Alexander McLaren and Elizabeth Stewart.Wouldn't be surprised if she was a relative of Sophia.
It seems reasonable to me that Sophia  born 1821 in Dull ,married 1849 in Edinburgh and in Dundee with James Murray in 1851 is the same person.Whether she went to Australia is not clear.Did she take her children with her?There is a parentless Jessie Murray in Ayr aged 11 in 1861 who might be Sophia's daughter.

[sarra]

You were looking at the Marriage Banns which were published in Edinburgh for Sophia and Ayr for James Murray.
William McLaren and Janet Dewar had children in both Dull(incl Sophia)and Logierait parishes.
You will find William at 1851 in Scone under the name McLaurin with his son Robert and Granddaughter Margaret.Janet Dewar seems to have died as William's wife is given as an Ann.All other details fit.William did not register either of his marriages.
In Dull at 1841 there is a Sophy McLearen aged 6.She was born Margaret Sophia McLaren in 1836 to Alexander McLaren and Elizabeth Stewart.Wouldn't be surprised if she was a relative of Sophia.
It seems reasonable to me that Sophia  born 1821 in Dull ,married 1849 in Edinburgh and in Dundee with James Murray in 1851 is the same person.Whether she went to Australia is not clear.Did she take her children with her?There is a parentless Jessie Murray in Ayr aged 11 in 1861 who might be Sophia's daughter

I really did not understand it, and there is an entry on the IGI, which does not make it very clear either....I won't say anymore about that one.
I found the 1851 census record you mention for William McLauren, so then I checked the 1841 census - found William McLaren living at the same address (Oakpark).
This time his wife appears to be Elizabeth (b.1801), the ages of the children, if these are the ones he had with Janet Dewar - do not seem line up with the births recorded on the IGI.
I don't know what to make of the daughter Margaret Sophia born, to Alexander McLaren & Elizabeth Stewart - I can't find this on on the 1841 census. Found on the 1851 census a Sophia McLaren - age 17 (paupers daughter) - with her mother Elizabeth Stewart, they are at Dull Perthshire.
I agree with your reasoning that the James Murray who married Sophia McLaren (b.1821 in Dull) in 1849 Edinburgh is the same one.
The only thing is that James Murray was not born in Ireland, as has been recorded on this  1851 census.
The Jessie Murray b.1850 - to James & Sophia Murray, did emigrate to Australia with them, although I'm still to find that shipping record.
She appears on the Victorian BMD Indexes.
Many thanks for posting that information that you found.
Sarra

[Cambron]

Why do you say he wasn't born in Ireland?
In 1841 there is an Irish James Murray of the correct age in Ayrshire with Irish parents.The mother is Margaret which would explain James' second daughter's name.

[sarra]

Why do you say he wasn't born in Ireland?
In 1841 there is an Irish James Murray of the correct age in Ayrshire with Irish parents.The mother is Margaret which would explain James' second daughter's name.

When James registered the birth of his daughter Margaret (b.1854) he gave his birth place as Scotland. That made me think that the 1852 census was incorrect - however I could be wrong. As you have found a good match for him on the 1841 census.
I'm using Ancestry and I tried to find the 1841 census you mention - without any luck - could you please give me the - parish number - Civil Parish - County, and anything else that will help me find it.
James Murray died in 1900, I don't have a copy of the death record - however the Indexes record his parents as - James Murray & Margaret Baldwin.
Thanks - Sarra