Author Topic: Hogg family  (Read 11384 times)

Offline JPatton

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Re: Hogg family
« Reply #9 on: Monday 06 May 13 10:31 BST (UK) »
The folks in the chatroom, I mean. Everyone wanted to help out. ---JP,

Offline diddymiller

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Re: Hogg family
« Reply #10 on: Monday 06 May 13 12:23 BST (UK) »
Hi, I have found further info since last posting. interesting articles on the British newspapers online site - adverts for Hoggs Nursery in Newcastle!

children I have from James & Ann Groves:
Jane              15/11/1825 Gateshead
Thomas         2/8/1827 Gateshead
Elizabeth       12/7/1829 gateshead   my line
Mary Ann       1834 newcastle
Maria Groves  Dec 1838 newcastle
James            1840 newcastle  died 1841

James 27/3/1801 kelso  married Ann Groves 6/2/1825 newcastle. he died between 1861 -1871

Thomas Hogg 1827 I have on the 1851 with his father, widower & mary & Maria at 6 Mansfield St, Westgate, newcastle as  a grocer aged 22. nothing on maria after 1851. Mary still with father 1861.

Diddy
Cooks -(Clackmannanshire); Erskines - (fife); Youngs - (Dunfermline); Charltons - (Tyneside ); Skillings - (N.Norfolk); Legg - (N.Yorks, Tyneside) ; Carter - (Durham); Miller -(suffolk); Pattinson -(Lincs)

Offline diddymiller

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Re: Hogg family
« Reply #11 on: Monday 06 May 13 17:26 BST (UK) »
have James (1801) as a judge at flower shows in N/C area until 1867 - Mr James Hogg, seedsman -  doesn't tie in with freebmd deaths.

have seen the 1870 death cert - not him

Diddy
Cooks -(Clackmannanshire); Erskines - (fife); Youngs - (Dunfermline); Charltons - (Tyneside ); Skillings - (N.Norfolk); Legg - (N.Yorks, Tyneside) ; Carter - (Durham); Miller -(suffolk); Pattinson -(Lincs)

Offline JPatton

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Re: Hogg family
« Reply #12 on: Tuesday 07 May 13 05:20 BST (UK) »
Thanks for all the information, Diddy. I researched some of the many Thomas Hoggs in the 1841, 1851 and 1861 censuses to see if I could find something familiar. I knew from seeing his name and age (28) on a Liverpool to Mobile, Alabama, USA passenger list in 1855 that my Thomas Hogg was born in about 1827. (His obituary, which I found in a family scrapbook, was undated, but it said he was 46 when he died in Mobile, Alabama (that makes his death year 1873) and it said he was from Newcastle Upon Tyne). I saw the family of James Hogg and Ann Groves and stopped in my tracks because:
1. My Thomas Hogg named his daughter "Annie" and this name is not from his wife's side of the family. James Hogg was married to an  "Ann."
2. A letter from Thomas's mother-in-law to his sister-in-law asked "How is Maria Hogg?" I thought she had to be a relative and the censuses of 1841 and 1851 showed that James and Ann Hogg had a daughter named Maria.

It would have been wonderful to have James' death date because then I'd know for sure if I was exploring the right family. A letter dated Sept 1863 between two sisters-in-law of my Thomas Hogg has this line:  "We received letters yesterday from England announcing the death of Mr. Hogg's Father and Uncle, he seemed to feel it very much indeed because his Father had been dead eighteen months and this was the first intelligence he had had of it." So this told me Thomas's father had died around March of 1862. And his uncle had died maybe around the same general time.

Okay, with that exploration at an impasse for the time being, I decided to find out what happened to Maria Groves Hogg after 1851. I guessed that she too came to Mobile and there IS a Maria Hogg, 21, a seamstress born in England, on the 1860 census for Mobile, living next door to James Groves, 43, clerk; his wife Annie, 33, and children Thomas, Emma, James, Annie, Robert and Marie. James was born in England. Annie, James' wife, was born in Scotland. Further research told me James came to the US in 1854. Do you know the siblings of Ann Groves? I guess that's next on my research list. What do you know of about your ancestor Elizabeth, if I may ask?  --many thanks, JP


Offline diddymiller

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Re: Hogg family
« Reply #13 on: Tuesday 07 May 13 08:42 BST (UK) »
Maria Groves Hogg: No info after 1851

Ann Groves: born about 1806. not in county 1841. died between 1841 -1851 (ie James widower on 1851) no further info .

Elizabeth Hogg: b. 12 /7/1829 Gateshead. my 2xggrandmother. maried John Pye Singleton 8/1/1851 newcastle. had 5 children - know all details. died mar 1866 Newcastle.

James Hogg (1801) there is a death june 1862 BUT there are articles in the Newcastle Journal with a Mr James Hogg, seedsman as judge at flower shows 1862 /1864/1867

There were a few other hogg families around at the time.

Diddy
Cooks -(Clackmannanshire); Erskines - (fife); Youngs - (Dunfermline); Charltons - (Tyneside ); Skillings - (N.Norfolk); Legg - (N.Yorks, Tyneside) ; Carter - (Durham); Miller -(suffolk); Pattinson -(Lincs)

Offline JPatton

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Re: Hogg family
« Reply #14 on: Tuesday 07 May 13 15:28 BST (UK) »
Diddy,

I think maybe this is the family I'm looking for if James Hogg's death was June, 1862. That's around the right time. Do you know the source for that date? Is it easy to find old articles in the Newcastle Journal? I know how to do look-ups in ScotlandsPeople, but besides that, I'm not proficient outside of finding things on ancestry.com. I take it the family was in Kelso, Scotland before coming to Newcastle? I guess I will pursue John Hogg and Janet Williamson from there, unless you can direct me in another.

All this news is truly great. I was resigned to never knowing Thomas Hogg's past before coming to the USA, and now, because of you, I can report to my folks that I've probably located his parents, grandparents and siblings. Thank you for being kind enough to respond to me here! You and this forum are just great! --JP

Offline JPatton

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Re: Hogg family
« Reply #15 on: Tuesday 07 May 13 15:50 BST (UK) »
Diddy,

I just did a search on ancestry.com and found on England & Wales, FreeBMD Death Index, 1837-1915 a James Hogg in Newcastle-Upon-Tyne who died in April of 1862, so he may be the husband of Ann and father of Thomas. I wish that index gave more information, but I suppose I'm lucky I found anything!--JP

Offline JPatton

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Re: Hogg family
« Reply #16 on: Tuesday 07 May 13 16:43 BST (UK) »
I also found that Adam Hogg, brother of James Hogg (who married Ann Groves) had a son named James, born between 1829 and 1831 and died in 1870. He was a nurseryman also, married to Elizabeth Ann Maillard. So perhaps he's the fellow in the Newcastle Journal articles. By the way, Adam Hogg in the 1871 census was a "nurseryman, seedsman" with 4 acres at Hoggs Nursery in Elswick, township of Newcastle. (but you probably knew this?)


Offline diddymiller

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Re: Hogg family
« Reply #17 on: Tuesday 07 May 13 17:48 BST (UK) »
Adam was married to Jane & had 7 children:
james 1831 -1870
william 1837
Sarah 1839
Charlotte Ann 1842
Ann 1843
joh 1845
Arthur 1849

i have all census until Adams death jan 1876 Newcastle. I also have his probate record to William & charlotte.
also details of 'Hoggs nursery'.

Diddy
Cooks -(Clackmannanshire); Erskines - (fife); Youngs - (Dunfermline); Charltons - (Tyneside ); Skillings - (N.Norfolk); Legg - (N.Yorks, Tyneside) ; Carter - (Durham); Miller -(suffolk); Pattinson -(Lincs)