Help please to find parents/siblings of Margaret HICK/S of Selby

[Alan of Kaslo]

Hello. I'm late to reply to this thread. I've read it many times as I have interest in Margaret Hick and Bedford's as well. My relative is Annie Bedford born 1879. It's hard to come by information on her and I had to dig hard and deep to come up with what I have.

I know through marriage and death documents that she was born in England in 1879 to William Bedford -railway guard and Jane Busby. That couple had several other girls in Selby/Leeds area of Yorkshire. Elisabeth , Martha , Ada , Edith  Margaret ... can all be seen on the GRO but no Annie in 1879. There is an entry for an Ann Bedford with mother listed as Bedford 1879 at Holbeck and I used to think that "must be" her... but now I when I look on the GRO there are other births in Holbeck around the time named Bedford with mother Bedford... meanwhile Jane Busby did have a daughter with William Bedford in 1875 named Louisa born in Selby.

Now for the mystery...

William Bedford railway guard was a widow when he married Jane Busby in 1866 (I have the marriage doc). As mentioned above William died young in 1875 at age 37 in Selby. To me it proves that Thomas Bedford joiner is William's father  which is great to know... but it opens up a can of worms...

How can William Bedford railwayman die in 1875 and father Annie Bedford in 1879? Although the records in Scotland say he is her father...

So then I checked other known daughters of Jane Busby and William Bedford. Starting with Elisabeth born 1867. It took me a while but I found her in Ireland marrying a Henry English in Londonderry.

the marriage of Elisabeth Bedford 1890 Londonderry:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1890/10707/5903338.pdf

As you can see the father she listed is John Bedford labourer and the mother Jane Busby. On her death in Scotland 1921 Elizabeth Bedford's documentation said widow of Henry English , daughter of Jane Busby and John Bedford...

This leads me to wonder if William Bedford 1838-1875 had a brother John?
Could Annie Bedford 1879's  father actually be John Bedford like Elisabeth's?

Seeing proof here that William Bedford the railway guard born 1838 died at age 37 in 1875... changed everything for me. Then I found reference to John Bedford fathering Elisabeth. Now I'm not sure if I am related to William Bedford or his parents Thomas and Margaret Hick. It would be interesting to compare DNA. At least one person who is a descendant of Thomas and Margret did not show any DNA connection to me. I realize DNA can be slippery though.

Anyhow , any help appreciated in any of this. Especially finding Annie Bedford's 1879 birth , potentially who her father was if it's true William Bedford died in 1875. Any information on the Bedford's of Selby mentioned early in this thread would be appreciated. Thanks.


 

[Alan of Kaslo]

I see now that Thomas Bedford did have a son named John born 1834 ... he apparently went to Australia in 1860 and became a school-master. Not sure if he came back to Selby in 1866/67 or why Elisabeth Bedford would state John as father on her docs.

Attached:  death of Elisabeth Bedford 1921. Father: John Bedford

[Pinetree]

Hi Alan,

Looking at the 1881 census where sadly the widowed Jane and her children are in Selby workhouse there is a Martha A Bedford listed aged 19 months born in York. So far I have been unable to find her birth record but could she be Annie?

I am not sure if the workhouse records for this period have survived but if they have there may be some clues there.

Do you happen to know where and when Jane (Busby) Bedford died? I can’t find her after 1881 census.

Pinetree

[Pinetree]

Have been doing some further digging and come up with a bit more on William Bedford although as he can not be the father of Annie it may be of limited use. Anyway this is what I have found:

1861 census - I believe he is living in Newton Heath, Lancashire pob transcrbed as Idley but on image reads as Selby to me.

21 April 1861 marries Mary Alice Tyson in Manchester - father given as Thomas Bedford, joiner - ages of couple on marriage record are a bit out but due to further findings below I think it is William from Selby.

1864 - birth of Elenor Bedford registered in Selby mmn Tyson. In 1871 and 1881 Eleanor is living with her married Aunt Eleanor Swift who was William’s sister.

20 August 1865 - Mary Alice Bedford is buried in Thirsk.  Thirsk is the same area as Sowerby where William married Jane Busby in 1866 and would fit with William being a widower when he married Jane.

Pinetree

[BushInn1746]

Not following thread, but is this any use?

York Herald, 22 June 1850
On Sunday, the 16th inst., aged 6 years, Charles, son of Mr. Bedford, of Selby, joiner.

Births
Charles BEDFORD       
Mother Maiden Surname: HICK 
GRO Reference: 1844  March Quarter in Registration District: SELBY

There was a Charles Knowles Bedford,
Mother M. S. Knowles, born 1843
Reg'n District Selby.
 ----------
Bedford was a Tenant Occupier of my ancestor George Hood on Gowthorpe, at Selby, Yorkshire - see the 1839 Selby Rate Book (top image) attached to:-
Reply #72
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=756955.msg6125594#msg6125594

Other Tenant Occupiers were:- Robert Wilkinson ; Wm Penrose ; Richard Nutt ; Widow Farrington.
 ----------
9th May 1829 at Selby, by Banns
Thomas Bedford &
Margaret Hick, both of this Parish.
Present at the Marriage:- George Bairsto ; Thomas Fryer.

[Alan of Kaslo]

Thanks a lot for the responses. I appreciate the time...

Someone mentioned to me that the 1875 death of William Bedford in Selby states that his son William Bedford is a beneficiary. Since William only had girls with Jane Bedford from what i can gather , it seems that this William son would have to be from the first marriage. Thanks for the tip on who his first wife was! I had seen that name in the GRO earlier. I'll have to check and see if I can see a son William by the same woman.

Also thanks for mentioning the possibility of Martha A possibly being Annie. I hadn't thought of that. The age lines up. I had been perturbed that I couldn't find Annie living with Jane and the sisters at the Selby workhouse.

I'll do some digging and come back with anything I can find. Meanwhile i'll digest what you all have shared here.

Do you happen to know where and when Jane (Busby) Bedford died? I can’t find her after 1881 census.

1881 Jane Busby Bedford was in the Selby workhouse with her daughters. Also in 1881 her fortunes changed and she married a tailor named James Hallcourt Early in Selby. Then they moved to Londonderry and had a few kids , eventually moving back to Glasgow. They start showing up in Glasgow census in 1901...as Jane Early age 56 Anderston. She lives with James and some kids that were born in Ireland. Annie Bedford is 22 at the time and marries a Laing...he dies and then she marries my grandfather James Robinson.

I've seen that before where a father listed on a birth doc had actually been dead for several years. With one relative they even wrote "can't possibly be the father as listed father has been dead 10 years - Illegitimate". Not sure if that is the case here. It's possible that if William Bedford died in 1875 that James Early could be the father of Annie and then married Jane a year or 2 later.

PS: I checked and couldn't see any William Bedford born to a Tyson mother anywhere at the time between 1861-1865. Not sure who William son of William is from the will probate...

Also...I can see no birth on the GRO for for any Martha Bedford with mother Busby or even any that looked like possibilities. There is nothing in Ireland. Of course as these things go there is a coincidental Martha Ann Bedford in Scotland born in 1879 ... I don't remember buying it but I had in the past and it is not the M.A. Bedford we are speaking about. That does leave the 1879 Holbeck

attached the probate info for William Bedford who died september 31 1875

[BushInn1746]

Selby Times, 30th July 1875
On the 25th inst., at Selby, Mr William Bedford’ aged 37 years.

Added
In the Yorkshire newspapers there are Bedford males at other places.

[BushInn1746]

The 1901 Census for Henry & Elizabeth English gives their address as Maryhill, Glasgow.

For Elizabeth English, the 1901 Glasgow Census transcription just says born England, Yorkshire.

Henry English was born Ireland ...

1870 -/+ 2 years Female search
Child surname Bedford
Mother M.S. Busby
gives

Ada Bedford,
Mother Maiden Surname: Busby
GRO Reference: 1872  S Quarter
Registration District Leeds

Elizabeth Bedford
Mother M.S. Busby
GRO Reference: 1867  S Quarter
Registration District Selby

1871 Jane Bedford 24 born Sowerby Thirsk.
 ----------
Jane Bedford
Mother M.S. BUSBY 
GRO Reference: 1864  D Quarter
Registration District Winslow

1871 & 1881 Jane Bedford, born Stewkley, Winslow, parents in the Census George & Jane.
 ----------
Sub-districts not given in Indexes.

Boy Births, nor other years not checked.

Selby was an inland Port for small vessels and parents of some children might have come from anywhere.

Selby also had many Nonconformists, some of whom also moved on.

[Alan of Kaslo]

Thanks for taking the time. I appreciate it!

There is this one also:

    Bedford, Margaret        BUOBY     
GRO Reference: 1869  J Quarter in THIRSK  Volume 09D  Page 348

Also... There is a fellow named William Bedford in the 1871 census living at Deptford St Paul, Kent, England. His info is here:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VB63-9RJ

Name   William Bedford
Sex   Male
Age   35
Birth Year (Estimated)   1836
Birthplace   Leeds, Yorkshire
Marital Status   Married
Occupation   Railway Engine Driver
Relationship to Head of Household   Head
Relationship Code   Head
Event Type   Census
Event Date   1871
Event Place   Deptford St Paul, Kent, England, United Kingdom

Then I finally found William Bedford and Jane Busby in 1871 census:
https://www.familysearch.org/tree/sources/viewedit/S3M1-N4M?context

Now I can see that there were 2 William Bedford's born around the same time from Leeds area that did railway work. The person with that familysearch page lists William Bedford's dying in 1879 but then goes and links to the 1875 death info. I am thankful they posted the 1871 census though.

So could there be two railwaymen William Bedford's born in Selby/Leeds around 1838? The one in Deptford was an engine driver and my William  was more of a porter/signalman/guard.

Any help greatly appreciated!

*attached* snip of the proper William Bedford in 1871 census