Author Topic: Grahams of Kilkeel  (Read 33265 times)

Offline kingskerswell

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Re: Grahams of Kilkeel
« Reply #54 on: Thursday 19 February 15 07:44 GMT (UK) »
Hi,
   Just a general point. Many of the reivers and their families found it expedient to move away from the England/Scottish border and to move themselves as far from authority as possible. For this reason many of the border names, eg Graham and Armstrong etc, can be found in Co. Fermanagh.

Regards

Stewart, Irwin, Morrison, Haslett, Murrell - Dungiven area Co. Londonderry
Browne, Barrett -Co.Armagh
Neil, Smyth _Co. Antrim

Offline dermotb

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Grahams DNA
« Reply #55 on: Monday 23 February 15 01:43 GMT (UK) »
If you want to look way back, this page has a very detailed and interesting analysis of the DNA of various Scottish clans, including Graham

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~gallgaedhil/dna_by_surname_1.htm


Offline dermotb

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Re: Grahams of Kilkeel
« Reply #56 on: Monday 23 February 15 23:57 GMT (UK) »
I noticed something very interesting about the parents of John Graham and Margaret Scott.

Their surnames are Graham, Irvine, Scott and Armstrong - all belonging to prominent border reiver families, all of them from South West Scotland. If (as this may suggest) the reiver descendants did tend to marry amongst themselves, our reiver bloodline may still be pretty strong.

Offline dermotb

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Re: Grahams of Kilkeel
« Reply #57 on: Saturday 21 March 15 11:17 GMT (UK) »
Here is a lovely photo, reportedly around 1907 according to the discussion under the photo. Bootshop sign is clearly visible just after the 8th upstairs window on the left.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/nlireland/9506150747/

and this one too.
http://www.oldwarrenpointforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1711

The discussion suggests it is Newry St, but it looks very much like GreenCastle St ahead (as stated on the postcard), with Newry St joining it on the right.



Offline crosshands

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Re: Grahams of Kilkeel
« Reply #58 on: Saturday 21 March 15 11:53 GMT (UK) »
Good spot - better photo than the ones I presently hold.  Would be lovely to think there are Grahams standing in the picture or perhaps they were too busy!

Offline dermotb

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Re: Grahams of Kilkeel
« Reply #59 on: Saturday 21 March 15 23:14 GMT (UK) »
I think the photo below may show John Graham (1851-1941) in his later years. The woman is Elizabeth (Bessie) Graham, with her son in the middle. The date is around 1935. Bessie was living in Dublin, not very far from Kilkeel.

The man on the right is unknown to present family members, but appears similar to the photo on this thread of John Graham.

Offline dermotb

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Re: Grahams of Kilkeel
« Reply #60 on: Sunday 22 March 15 05:40 GMT (UK) »
A couple more items of interest.

First, there has been reference to Brethren in this thread. I was curious because my grandmother Bessie Graham (b1881) married a Plymouth Brethren man, and I wondered what made him travel from England to Ireland, when the Brethren were notorious for not mixing with outsiders.

The answer may be that the Brethren actually originated in Dublin in the 1820's, and then spread to England soon afterwards. The Dublin connection and its proximity to Kilkeel may be why it had reached some of the Grahams, and it explains why my grandfather visited this part of Ireland. As my mother put it "the young Plymouth Brethren were thrown together as much as possible in order that they would marry each other and produce more little Brethren". It seems likely, therefore, that Bessie was already a Brethren member before meeting her husband.

The second thing is the book below, being reminiscences of a Kilkeel man born in 1879, so he grew up in the same era as many of the children of James and Margaret Graham. Although it never mentions Grahams, I think it's well worth a read to get a flavour for the times. It has some lovely stories.
http://www.lennonwylie.co.uk/HughMarks1.htm


Offline dermotb

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Re: Grahams of Kilkeel
« Reply #61 on: Saturday 11 April 15 03:27 BST (UK) »
The 1901 and 1911 census pages for the Grahams not only have scans of the handwritten forms (and I think John Graham filled out the 1901 form himself, because the handwriting matches his signature), but scans of other forms, including a record of who was in the shops along Greencastle street, and the number of rooms.

In 1901, the Grahams are shown at number 4, living in 6 rooms.

In 1911, number 4 is blank (a row of dashes), and John Graham and his boot shop are shown at number 61, with 11 people staying in 6 rooms (however, two of them, Herbert Buckley and Walter Balson, are visiting grandsons of Annie and Bessie, who are married and living elsewhere). The family census form confirms this, showing the street number 61. So it seems that the boot shop may have moved between about 1907 (the date of the photo in an earlier post above) and 1911.

And I have found another photo, showing Bessie and her family with a couple of Bessie's sisters, I'm guessing in the early 1920's judging by the age of the young boy at bottom right (my father), born in 1917. Bessie is on the right, and two of her sisters are on the left, named as Aunt "Gorly" and Aunt Maud respectively, by Bessie's daughter Olive (standing next to her mother), who labelled this photo.


Offline dermotb

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Re: Grahams of Kilkeel
« Reply #62 on: Saturday 16 May 15 10:28 BST (UK) »
I have discovered something rather exciting - PRONI has the daybooks and ledgers of John Graham's shoe shop from 1886 to 1932. I have emailed PRONI about the cost of digitising them, but I fear it will be prohibitive. Perhaps a sample set of pages would be enough.

The best would obviously be to visit PRONI and view these documents, but I live in Australia. Suggestions welcome.