Charles Shirley Cadman - deceased 1832

[sunflower]

Thanks Janey, I hadn't seen the duplicate thread.  The marriage between Charles Cadman & Melnora Shirley in 1795 is certainly worth more research.

Carol

[Cadmanfamily]

To Sunflower,
A contributor has drawn attention to a burial at Shoreditch, St. Leonard on 19th November 1816 of Millinora Cadman, age 46, of Noah's Ark. (what was this, I wonder - a pub?) This looks like the same person as 'Melnora' as both names sound very similar. Also a Charles Cadman (possibly Millinora's husband?) was occupying a property in Crown Street, in the Hoxton Square area of St. Leonard's Shoreditch in 1796 according to Land Tax records. I hope this helps.

Answering your earlier questions - I do not have a copy of the marriage licence of Charles Shirley Cadman and Mary Hay (Hayes or variant), only copies of newspaper cuttings, courtesy of Dizzifish, reporting the ceremony. Unfortunately, these do not mention the identity of the witnesses. I haven't looked at the original entry in the Mansfield records and am uncertain how I can call them up.

Geoff Ambridge "CadmanFamily"

[Dizzifish]

A bit more info.....

Marriage - St Peters, Mansfield, Nottinghamshire - 20th Aug 1823 (Fiche 72 /entry 234)
CHARLES SHIRLEY CADMAN, bachelor of this parish.
& MARY HAYES, spinster of the parish of Warsop in this County.
Were married in this Church by License this Twentieth day of August 1823
By me: Tho's. L. Cursham. Vicar
Marriage was solemnized between us} Chas Shirley Cadman & Mary Hays
In the presence of: Luke Smith, Mary Webster & Joseph Webster.

I can't see any connection re the witnesses to Charles Cadman or Mary Hayes. 

Note: I see on the marriage license transcript that Joseph Webster was bondsman and "organist of Mansfield, Nottinghamshire"

On one of the baptisms of Joseph Webster's children he was described as "music master".
Joseph Webster married Agnes Sansom at Mansfield in 1804, he is in Mansfield in 1841 and described as "Organist" = HO107 piece 859 folio 5/4 page 1


Sheila.

[sunflower]

Hi Geoff

The marriage licences for Nottingham are kept at this address. 

Manuscripts and special collections
The University of Nottingham
Kings Meadow Campus
Lenton Lane
Nottingham
NG7 2NR

01159514565

Regards
Carol

[Cadmanfamily]

To Dizzifish and Sunflower,

Thank you very much for the additional information. I note that a John Shirley and Letitia Story were the witnesses of the marriage of Charles Cadman, widower, otp and Melnora [sic.] Shirley, spinster, otp, at Islington, St. Mary's, on 6th May 1795. If the above mentioned Charles Cadman was the father of Charles Shirley Cadman, is there any way to ascertain the identity of the former's father (or parents) and any details relating to the place of residence.  Can anyone enlighten me as to what a 'Bondsman' was?  Was this some kind of guarantor?

To Dizzifish - Thank you very much for sending me the copies of newspaper clippings reporting the marriage of Charles Shirley Cadman and Mary Cadman (nee Bettaney) on 20th Aug. 1823 and for the enlargement of one image.   

Best wishes,
Geoff Ambridge "CadmanFamily"

[Dizzifish]

Hi Geoff,

 A couple of explanations as to the roll of Bondsman and the other query of what "fl." means.

https://familysearch.org/learn/wiki/en/Marriage_Allegations,_Bonds_and_Licences_in_England_and_Wales

The bond, sworn "by two sufficient witnesses", one of whom was usually the groom, his father or a friend, pledged to forfeit a large sum of money (ranging from £40 to £200), if there was any consanguinity (a relationship within the prohibited degrees) between the parties or any pre-contract to another person. The large sum of money to be forfeit was intended to underline the serious nature of the oath, and it should not be thought that the couple had these funds at their disposal. The second bondsman soon became a formality, any convenient person acting. Later the second bondsman was often completely fictitious, names like John Doe and Richard Row being used.

~ ~ ~
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floruit

Floruit - abbreviated fl. (or occasionally, flor.), is a Latin verb meaning "flourished", denoting the period of time during which something (such as a person, school, movement, or species) was active. In English, the word may also be used as a noun indicating the time when someone "flourished"
Broadly, the term is employed in reference to the peak of activity for a person, movement, or such. More specifically, it often is used in genealogy and historical writing when a person's birth or death dates are unknown, but some other evidence exists that indicates when he or she was alive. For example, if there are wills attested by John Jones in 1204, 1207, and 1229, and a record of his marriage in 1197, a record concerning him might be written as, "John Jones (fl. 1197–1229)".
~~ ~


Sheila.

[Cadmanfamily]

Please note that, as Charles Shirley Cadman, late of Derbyshire and Nottinghamshire, seems to have had his origins in London/Middlesex, a 2nd thread with some interesting contributions, is currently running in order to cover that region. To gain access to that Forum please click on the following link:

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,651417.10.html

Geoff Ambridge "CadmanFamily"

[AndyBasic]

Comment on Dizzfish message  -
"Joseph Webster married Agnes Sansom at Mansfield in 1804, he is in Mansfield in 1841 and described as "Organist" = HO107 piece 859 folio 5/4 page 1"

I don't think this is the correct marriage for Joseph Webster - in the 1841 and the 1851 Census Joseph Webster is described as Organist and is with his daughter Ann who was born about 1812.   The Ann Christened at Mansfield in 1812 is the daughter of Joseph and Anne Webster. I can't find a marriage for this couple but I don't think they are the same couple as Joseph and Agnes who were also having children christened at the same time as Joseph and Anne

A bit more info.....

Marriage - St Peters, Mansfield, Nottinghamshire - 20th Aug 1823 (Fiche 72 /entry 234)
CHARLES SHIRLEY CADMAN, bachelor of this parish.
& MARY HAYES, spinster of the parish of Warsop in this County.
Were married in this Church by License this Twentieth day of August 1823
By me: Tho's. L. Cursham. Vicar
Marriage was solemnized between us} Chas Shirley Cadman & Mary Hays
In the presence of: Luke Smith, Mary Webster & Joseph Webster.

I can't see any connection re the witnesses to Charles Cadman or Mary Hayes. 

Note: I see on the marriage license transcript that Joseph Webster was bondsman and "organist of Mansfield, Nottinghamshire"

On one of the baptisms of Joseph Webster's children he was described as "music master".
Joseph Webster married Agnes Sansom at Mansfield in 1804, he is in Mansfield in 1841 and described as "Organist" = HO107 piece 859 folio 5/4 page 1


Sheila.