1851 Census Lookup Please!

[MonicaL]

A possible death?

A Jean Cruickshanks/Dye, aged 58, died in Abbotshall, Fife in 1868. Wondering if this may be connected to Elizabeth's mother maybe given the names we saw for Helen Dye Veitch's children (and possible use of naming pattern).

I saw this 1871 census entry too. Age a bit light for Thomas, but can be the way with censuses (never mind spellings!):

Thomas Dye 54 weaver b. Dunfermline
John Baird 11 grandson b. Edinburgh
Address: Beveridgewell, Dunfermline Burgh

The marriage cert for Helen (if correct  ) should hopefully confirm whether parents were still alive or deceased at the time of her marriage in 1865.

Monica

[kpnut]

Hi again Monica

sorry I think our messages crossed.  WOW that is BRILLIANT info.  Do you know if I have to send for the certificate from a Scottish site or can I order it from where I usually order, which is the GRO Office?

Just to let you know that the link you gave me for the Jean Cruickshanks Veith didn't work, so I couldn't look at it, it just came up saying there was a problem.

I'll try to check out some more info, but you seem to be finding more than me, and I am VERY grateful indeed.

Regards
Karen

[MonicaL]

Karen

I am thinking now that Jane Cruickshanks (not confirmed!) is possibly a second wife to Thomas. There is this entry here for 1841, everyone born outside of the county of Midlothian:

Thomas Day 30 Sawer J
Mary Day 30 b. Scotland
John Day 11
Thomas Day 8
Mary Day 6
James Day 2
Address: Lasscide Lane, North Leith, Midlothian

Helen's mother is showing as Mary Gillespie which is the name she gave to her first born daughter, as above.

Obsessing now  See snippet from Helen Dye marriage in 1865:

[kpnut]

Hi Monica

Can I just ask, where are you actually looking to find all this info, as I can't seem to see any of it?  Is it the scotlandspeople site?

I've been looking on Ancestry, but so far I can't see it.

I'll look again.

Thanks
Karen

[MonicaL]

Karen...Ancestry are only really useful in Scotland research for the census transcripts (mighty useful though!). All other documentation (such as BMDs) and images for censuses are only available via the Scotlands People site.

Monica

PS: Sent you a Personal Message (PM). Hope you get it ok.

[MonicaL]

Just trying to firm up a little more of what we are seeing. There is a marriage in Dunfermline area in 1828 that would fit well: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTPZ-5LJ  This connects us well to potentially the family in Leith for 1841, with Thomas Day, a sawyer (joiner etc) with his wife Mary and family in Leith.

With Helen showing her mother as Mary Gillespie on her 1865 marriage, the question I would have relevant for you now, is Elizabeth's mother Mary Gillespie or Jane Cruickshanks?

Have you got a list of Elizabeth's children in order from birth, including any middle names? Maybe some clues from there.

Monica

Added:

At last some FS entries!

Alexander 1829 https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XY8M-WTY (died young?)
John 1829 https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XYZ1-19K...thinking twins with John born next day!
James 1835 https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XY8M-699 (died young, name reused?)

[jennywren001]

Amazing Monica - really tricky with those names! I've been looking at 'Airntully'  which is in the Parish of Kinclaven where I think Jane/Jean is from. It's the best fit from the 1861 census transcription. Using Freecen and Kinclaven for the parish there are only 9 Cruickshanks including a 30 year old Jean with parents. Unlikely, she is the mom but always good to know a bit more
Jen

[kpnut]

Hi again Monica

I sent you an email - I hope you got it.

In a word, NO, I don't know which one out of Jane or Mary was Elizabeth's mother.  I've just looked at both of her marriage certificates (1867 to Michael) and (1874 to Bartholomew) and on BOTH of them, Thomas "Day" is listed as a Joiner.  It doesn't mention "deceased" and having found him in later censuses, I know this to be correct.

Is there any way for me to get Elizabeth's birth certificate?  Would that have to be from Scotlandspeople, and if so, would you be able to get any references for me and let me know what I have to do to send off for it.

You've been BRILLIANT Monica and I'm going to try to piece together all the info you've given me so far, and Jenny, thanks for mentioning Airntully.  I saw on the 1861 census that it said Jane's birth place was Arinktty, Perthshire, but when I did a google search for it, nothing came up, so thanks for that.

Any other info will be gratefully appreciated.

Monica, Elizabeth's children are as follows:

From 1st marriage to Michael Robinson:
Michael Robinson born 1868
Mary Robinson born 1872
Anthony Robinson born 1873

From 2nd marriage to Bartholomew Hudson Thewlis:
Charlotte McKenzie Thewlis born 1876
James Ridley Thewlis born and died 1877
James Day Thewlis born 1879
Helen Veitch Thewlis born 1881 (my great grandmother).

Hope this helps
Karen

[MonicaL]

Hi Karen and Jen

Back again...busy times!

Did  you get my email with certs Karen?

Just to update post here, in case anyone can help further. Jane/Jean Cruickshanks does seem to be a likely second wife to Thomas. Closest I got with birth for her was this entry https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VQ71-9DM Hard to say with ages for her so far. This FS entry might be a first Jane that died and then name reused. Don't know really    At least four children show for this couple in Kinclaven, Perthshire.

See below: