Help needed in tracing Philip Ball

[Alan7636]

I am perhaps more fortunate than most in so much as the majority of my research has centred on London and Lincolnshire and any brick walls I have come up against have taken little time in knocking down, except that is for one, a great x 3 Grandfather, Philip Ball, who according to the 1841/51 census and his death certificate was born about 1804. But as for a place of birth the only clues I have are the fact he died in Leicester Asylum in 1852 plus 3 short lines in the Stamford Mercury of the 13th December 1850 that state;

Lincoln Thursday 12th December ‘Philip Ball who is now an inmate of one of the Yorkshire Lunatic Asylums, and who is chargeable to the Parish of St Martin (Lincoln) was proved to belong to the Parish of Oakham. 

Philip is well known in Lincoln history and I have a full knowledge of his exploits from 1826 to 1852 including the fact he languished in Lincoln castle prison and the London Fleet prison for many years but as I say I have never found a baptism for him.

I am therefore hoping that some kind soul with access to the Rutland and in particular Oakham Parish records may be able to throw some light on the matter. Any help would be appreciated.

Alan   

[Bunnygirl]

Hi Alan 7636,
I've had a look on my CD for Oakham and sorry no record of a Philip Ball baptized in Oakham record goes up to 1837

Sorry
Bunnygirl

[Alan7636]

Hello Bunnygirl

Many thanks for searching your records. I have a feeling this is one wall that may take a lot more research than just Baptism records and perhaps a few days at the Leicester Archives are called for.

Once again thanks for taking the time to look.

Alan

[!Samantha!]

Hello Alan,

Just thought I would drop you a line after accidentally stumbling on your post late last night.  I too have Philip Ball in my family tree and I found the information you have extremely interesting.  I was told that he wanted to extend his garden so he encroached onto the castle mount in doing so he uncovered the old west gate to the castle.  He was asked to stop but because he didn't he was sent to prison and his property was held in chancery where it remains today.  I had always thought that was at 6 Union Rd. I never knew he was involved with the Strugglers!  Good luck with the rest of your search. 

[Alan7636]

Hello Samantha and welcome to RootsChat.

I was more than intrigued to read you’re posting Re: Philip Ball, not from the fact that you have him in your family tree, although I am interested in knowing your relationship to Philip, but more from the point that you mention 6 Union Road, Lincoln.
 
The property, now long demolished to make way for public access to the Western Gate of the castle, was the birth place of my Maternal Grandmother, Maud Wheatley, and her 18 siblings. I also have vague recollections of visiting as a small child with my mother, a relative living there.
Regarding Philip, my 3 x Great-grandfather, I have carried out extensive research into his life from when he married in Stamford in 1825, his incarceration in both Lincoln Castle gaol and Fleet prison in London, to his death in 1852 in Leicester Asylum and would be more than happy to share my research with you.
 
Unfortunately I am unable to correspond privately on the RootsChat PM system until you have made 2 or 3 posts on the board. Then we can work out privately a way of getting my story of Philip (and his interesting family) to you.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Alan

[!Samantha!]

Hello Alan and thank you! Although I'm not sure how this site works!!

I'm sorry for not replying sooner.  I haven't used this site since posting the comment on your feed.  As I pass the Strugglers every morning on the way to work I say to myself "I must check in."  I was so surprised to hear that you have connections with the Wheatley family because it's through the Wheatley family that I came across Philip Ball, when an Ellen Ball (I think she's his grand daughter but I'm not to sure because I think her father was also Philip Ball!!)  married Samuel Wheatley.  When you mentioned your grandmother having 18 siblings it reminded me of a story my grandfather (also  Samuel Wheatley!) told me about someone in his family having 21 children twice because the 21st child died and they went on to have another! My family history really interests me but I find it so confusing at times especially when children have the same names as their father's!!

Best wishes Samantha

[Alan7636]

Hello Samantha and thank you so much for replying.

Please also accept my apologies for the delay in getting back to you but I have only yesterday returned home after being confined in Lincoln Hospital for 10 days.

You are correct about Ellen; she was my  Great-grandmother and the daughter of Phillip William Ball who was the eldest son of Philip Ball of the Strugglers.

Since moving to Lincoln exactly 2 years ago I have attempted to trace living Wheatley and Ball relations without success but at last I might have been successful  . If your Grandmother was Sarah Ann Bartlett born in Great Grimsby in 1881 and she had at least 9 children:

Alfred born 1904
Cecil born 1906
Harold born1908
Violet born 1912
Florence born 1914
Samuel born 1916
Freda born 1919
Charles born 1921
Arthur born 1922

Then we are most certainly related  and I have a host of stories about the Ball and Wheatley families that you may not be aware of and I would love to share them with you.

If you reply to this particular message it should then be possible to contact each other via the Rootschat private message system at the top of the page so that I can arrange to send you all the information on our family(Rootschat does not allow such things as personal email addresses etc. to be posted for general viewing, this to avoid spam).

I look forward to hearing from you.

Alan

[!Samantha!]

Hello Alan,

Lovely to hear from you again but sorry to hear that you have been in hospital, hope you're well now!!

Sarah is my Great Grandmother, her son Samuel (born 1916) was my Grandfather.  His wife (my Grandma) is still with us aged 97!  As a child I remember visiting my great Auntie Violet and her husband Uncle Wagg! Also my great Auntie Florrie and Uncle Frank!  Sadly I don't remember Freda or Charles but I do have fond memories of my great uncle Arthur, he reminded me of my Grandad.  My Great uncle Harold, who was a police officer, wrote a story of his life living in the Westgate area which he called the "Mount Children" it was published in a local parish magazine, Phillip Ball was mentioned in his story! It does sound like we are related, which is amazing, but there's more people than just me!!

Look forward to hearing from you soon!! x

[Alan7636]

Hi Samantha

I have sent you a private message containing my email details.

Alan