Author Topic: Peter William Hollands, born Five Islands? NSW  (Read 7734 times)

Offline Nova67

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 906
    • View Profile
Re: Peter William Hollands, born Five Islands? NSW
« Reply #27 on: Saturday 18 January 14 06:08 GMT (UK) »
 A William Holland died at 75 in 1886.  Left 2nd wife and 2 young children, and 3 adult children by 1st wife:
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/127945037?searchTerm="William hollands" &searchLimits=l-title=503

Offline Nova67

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 906
    • View Profile
Re: Peter William Hollands, born Five Islands? NSW
« Reply #28 on: Saturday 18 January 14 06:18 GMT (UK) »
Even if he is related, doesn't look like much in the way of parental information on his death certificate:
13718/1886  HOLLAND  WILLIAM  AGE 75 YEARS  DIED SHOALHAVEN  SHOALHAVEN 

Offline Nova67

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 906
    • View Profile
Re: Peter William Hollands, born Five Islands? NSW
« Reply #29 on: Saturday 18 January 14 06:27 GMT (UK) »
NSW BDM site was just loading slowly, but this must be the 2nd marriage:
4866/1880  HOLLAND  WILLIAM S  RYAN  BRIDGET  SHOALHAVEN
I suppose???? he could be Peter William Hollands grandfather????  But hopefully not a wild goose chase.  This certificate might have more info about his background.

Offline Ladyhawk

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,554
    • View Profile
Re: Peter William Hollands, born Five Islands? NSW
« Reply #30 on: Saturday 18 January 14 10:16 GMT (UK) »

The birth certificate for Peter Hollond lists his father Peter Hollond as the informant and Harriett Rosina Harmer as his mother.

It states the mother 20 at the birth in 1884 and born in England, which fits with the research done above.

The marriage was in 1883 and the father 45 at the birth

The marriage certificate doesn't have any information about parents, ages, or birthplaces

It lists Harriett as a widow and peter as a bachelor.


Thank you for the update  :)

Do you think a mistake was made on the certificate with their marital status?

I would have thought Peter was the more likely to have been widowed as he was aged 45  :-\

If  it’s the correct Harriet Harmer occ Kitchen Maid arriving in NSW 19 May 1883 and they married the same year 1883  - I wonder where they met

Might be worth trying to trace Harriet Rosina Harmer/Fuller on 1881 census to see if that leads anywhere - I have not been able to find her - she's not with the mother Ellen & stepfather John Fuller  ???

Not having much luck trying to find Peter Holland born c1838 either to see when he arrived in NSW  - he’s not on the same ship as Harriet

What was Peter’s occupation on the b/c & his m/c and are there any witnesses named?

If by any chance there was a mistake and Peter was widowed  when they married
I wonder if this might be him - of course it could just  be a coincidence  but thought I'd post anyway because of pob & age of this Peter Holland

Ireland, 1841/1851 Census Abstracts (Northern Ireland)

Headings
Surname given rel. age. Marr. Film remarks location
Peter HOLLAND Head 40 (1837) 00993101 Tyrone
Bridget wife 29 Clogher nee Connolly
Mary dau. 10 Errigal Trough
Patrick son 8 Altadaven
Bridget dau 6
Catherine dau 9m claimant, m McKenna

Looking to see if I can find this family on later censuses - will post if I find anything useful

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline Nova67

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 906
    • View Profile
Re: Peter William Hollands, born Five Islands? NSW
« Reply #31 on: Saturday 18 January 14 19:49 GMT (UK) »
Further to the information about the other Holland/s family in the district. Other public family trees on Ancestry suggest William Hollands  was born in East Malling, England and married 3 times. I found the following convict information - not included on the trees I viewed - and the occupation fits the newspaper article about his death:
http://foundersandsurvivors.org/pubsearch/convict/chain/c31a31200099
Coronial information on Ancestry states born in England.
I also found the births of his two other children with Bridget.
So possibly this is all a red herring to your quest for Peter William Hollands ??? I just didn't know how many Hollands' :-\ were likely to be living in the Shoalhaven district.

Offline Nova67

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 906
    • View Profile
Re: Peter William Hollands, born Five Islands? NSW
« Reply #32 on: Saturday 18 January 14 20:13 GMT (UK) »
Will look for the 1881 Census.

Offline Nova67

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 906
    • View Profile
Re: Peter William Hollands, born Five Islands? NSW
« Reply #33 on: Saturday 18 January 14 20:41 GMT (UK) »
Possibly her 1881:

Harriet Harmer
General Domestic Servant
Single
Female
b. 1862
Birthplace: NK (not known) ::)
Piece: 1024
Folio: 38
Page: 2
Reg District: Hastings
Civil Parish: Hastings St Mary in the Castle
Address: 4 York Buildings, Hastings St Mary in the Castle, Sussex

Offline Nova67

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 906
    • View Profile
Re: Peter William Hollands, born Five Islands? NSW
« Reply #34 on: Saturday 18 January 14 22:31 GMT (UK) »
Necessary to re read post replies #18 and #25 in view of this alternative 1861 England Census suggestion:
Ellen Harmer
b. abt 1839 (18)
Birthplace: Ashburnham, Sussex
Inmate
Occupation: General Servant
Female
Reg District: Battle
Sub District: Battle
Piece:563
Folio: 43
Page: 13
Address:  Battle Union Workhouse, Sussex

with Annie Harmer aged 1 month
b. Ashburnham, Sussex

Offline majm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 25,385
  • NSW 1806 Bowman Flag Ecce signum.
    • View Profile
Re: Peter William Hollands, born Five Islands? NSW
« Reply #35 on: Saturday 18 January 14 23:01 GMT (UK) »
JM has some excellent advice about those blanks on historic NSW marriage certs.   Essentially not all info was passed onto reg so need to contact church archives to get the missing info.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,546609.0.html

cheers,
   Ros

Thanks Ros  ;D

Yes, those blanks you notice on the NSW BDM record of the marriage ARE simply because NSW BDM has not ever finalised their own tasks of reconciliation that they started over 100 years ago.

The bride and the groom both provided the clergyman with the names of their respective parents (including their mums’ nee names, the occupations of their dads) and they also provided that clergyman with their own places of birth and their own ages as well as other information that did not get forwarded to the NSW BDM due to a long running dispute between “Church and State” that was not resolved in NSW until the mid 1890s.

The clergymen DID record the information and NSW BDMs website notes it, and gives you pointers to overcoming the lack of info on their own records.

http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/bdm_fh/bdm_rec.html

“1856 to  1895 church marriage registers … the task …… the marriage registrations was never finalised. The Registry's records from these years are not complete and it can be worthwhile for genealogists to contact the relevant church to find details missing from a marriage “.

Remember of course that info on a marriage certificate is information given FIRST HAND so it is often considered more reliable than say info on a death cert,  So it would be sensible to seek out the church registers current location and find the info they gave the clergyman.  Please type up the info that IS on that marriage cert. 

Date and place of Marriage

BRIDEGROOM’s:
Full Name
Occupation
Place of residence
Conjugal status
Place and date of birth
Age
Father’s full name
Mother’s full name, including former and nee names

BRIDE’s
Full Name
Occupation
Place of residence
Conjugal status
Place and date of birth
Age
Father’s full name
Mother’s full name, including former and nee names

Married according to the rites of :  (denomination)

With the consent of

Who were the witnesses?

What was the clergyman’s name?
……………………………………….

From the NSW ER 1878 SHOALHAVEN
John HOLLAND, residence, Nowra
John HOLLAND, junior, residence Nowra
Willam HOLLAND, residence Terara

GREVILLES PO Dir 1875 for Nowra has a John HOLLAND, a bootmaker.   I can find Terara in that edition, but NO mention of HOLLAND or variations.

Cheers,  JM


The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
I do not have a face book or a twitter account.