Kathleen May Andrews

[Jondi99]

Good afternoon.

For some time I have been searching for my father's siblings all of whom were born in Worcestershire but all but one appear to have moved elsewhere.  My father never disclosed that he had any siblings or that his parents were alive up to the early 1960s and as a result I have had very little to work on.  I have been fortunate in tracing his brothers but his sister has remained a mystery and living a long way (East Anglia) from my father's origins it has not been easy to visit any location which may be relevant.

Kathleen May Andrews was born 28 September 1918 (I have a copy of her birth certificate) but thereafter I have been unable to find any details for her at all.  Recently I found a death in St. Austell where the name and dob match exactly but still I have been unable to confirm if they are one and the same.  If they are it is almost certain that she never married (unless to a person with the same paternal surname) but how she ended her days in Cornwall is not apparent.  Details of the entry I found are given below.

I feel it unlikely that two people would share exactly the same name and date of birth but wondered if there is any way of being more certain from any records or data available locally.  Is there anyone who could suggest a method of confirming one way or the other the identity of the individual concerned, please?

With thanks in anticipation.



Kathleen May Andrews b 28 Sep 1918 death registered Jan 2003 age 84
St Austell Cornwall ref 5D District and Subdistrict:    367/1A entry 39

[JaneyCanuck]

Getting a copy of the death certificate to see who registered the death is probably your best chance of getting answers; since the death was fairly recent, if a friend or family member was the informant you might be able to find them.

Other than that ... it would be bad enough if the quarter of registration for your Kathleen's birth were definite, but she was born on the cusp and could have been registered in Q3 or Q4 ... and FreeBMD reports 942 "Kathleen M" births in that period. Any one of them could have been born on the same day and married a Mr. Andrews. And in fact, from 1935 to 1980 there were 66 marriages of Kathleen Ms to Messrs. Andrews.

I would get the death certificate to see whether it identifies that KMA as a married woman, at least. It does seem there is a good chance the woman in question is your person, and hopefully that would give you enough info to rule her in or out.

She could have been on holiday in Cornwall 

[Isobelruss]

You could see if she was on any electoral roles,that would give an address and maybe who else lived with her,a few credits on FindMyPast may help with this.

[Jondi99]

Many thanks for your replies.

Unfortunately it looks as if my earlier thoughts have been confirmed as I have no knowledge of any friends or possible family in Cornwall and a journey of some 650 miles return is not a reasonable option the death certificate with its shortcomings is my only route.

A check for any record in the electoral roles revealed only one hit but in Lancashire so that route failed.  It could be she opted to keep her name from the full list though.  Of course the full list can only be viewed at the offices so that puts that option out as well.

I feel the chances of finding two people with exactly the same name and date of birth is reasonably remote and have hopes that I may at last have found her.

Thanks again for your suggestions.

[Jondi99]

I have the Death Certificate and it is for my father's sister.  I have been in contact with the family who find the news very interesting but in total conflict to the information they have lived with all their lives.

The Death Certificate reads:

Name and surname: Kathleen May SMITH formerly known as Kathleen May ANDREWS.

Maiden name: KNIGHT.

Her Birth Certificate clearly shows her registered as Kathleen May ANDREWS.

During her life Kathleen believed she was born Knight as her mother used that name.  However her mother left my grandfather and three other children (presumably when Kathleen was very young) to live with Knight.  They brought up Kathleen with other children (five of) fathered by Knight.

As a result my remaining full cousin and her husband are now trying to piece together the 'new' family history and advise the remainder of the family members (full and now half cousins, nephews, nieces and others) of the facts.

I also have another problem in that I can find a marriage between Knight and Kathleen's mother, but no divorce from my grandfather.  Routes to confirm the existence of a divorce are not easy to find and records even more so.  As a result any advice would be appreciated.

"Oh what a tangled web we weave,
When first we practise to deceive!"

[JaneyCanuck]

Hi again. On the divorce question, one thing you might do is get the marriage certificate for Kathleen's mother and Mr Knight to see what marital status she declared.

Often, the marriage of a divorced woman will be recorded under both her birth surname and her first married surname -- while a widow would marry only under her first married surname. I see that Kathleen's mother married only under the surname Andrews. Only the certificate would say for sure what status she declared.

(I'm not giving names since you didn't, but Kathleen's birth shows her mother's surname, and I then found her mother's first marriage, to get the two spouses' names.)

Do you know when Mr Andrews died? (not sure whether he is the parent you referred to as living until the 60s, or that was Mr Knight) Since Kathleen's mother seems to have waited quite some time after the separation to remarry, could it be that she remarried only after Mr Andrews died?

Were all of Kathleen's half-siblings' births registered in the name Andrews? It's just that I'm seeing a cluster of 5 births registered that way, and not the same for Knight.

[JaneyCanuck]

There is a cluster of 4 births in the name Knight with Kathleen's mother's surname (there are also others in other locations in the same timeframe, possibly one in 1919 in particular). It could fit with this marriage for Kathleen and the location of the death of the husband in that marriage:

Kathleen M Knight + Abiah H Smith
Bridgend, 1939

Abiah Haydn Smith
dob 2 Jul 1915 (aged 71)
Pontypridd, Aug 1986

There are births that could be to that marriage (the others extending to abt 1970). The name of the first in particular suggests that it was.

That person's current location suggests a connection. I will send you that info privately.

[Jondi99]

Hello JaneyCanuck,

Many thanks for your suggestion.  I have ordered the subject marriage certificate and hope to understand better the situation from this.

As for the rest I have sent it you privately.

Many thanks for your help.