records of Printers/Stationers in London 1700-1800 MORGAN & RAMSHAW

[gracem]

I have two families MORGAN & RAMSHAW who lived at Dogwell Court, Lombard Street Whitefriars. I know that James RAMSHAW printed maps and his son moved to Southampton (Ordnance Survey). I know that William MORGAN was a printer and that several generations earlier there was a William MORGAN who printed maps and lived at Dogwell Court. I have nothing to link the early William to the later, or any idea whether the later William printed maps.
Does anyone have access to early records of stationers / printers in London. I think that James may have been apprenticed to William (he married William's daughter) but haven't found a record and I would also like to be able to follow William back to see if there is a connection to early map printers.  I think he died in 1791, that he married first Jane (and had Peter, Mary, Jane, William, Mary Hannah, and Sarah in the years 1765-1772) then Frances (and had Mary, Frances, Sarah, Samuel, James, Joseph and Joseph in the years 1774-1790). If I am right he started in Holborn and moved to Fleet Street before moving to Whitefriars in 1780. Is there any relevance in the naming pattern? Were Williams parents Peter and Mary?
If William died in 1791 leaving a widow and children would the stationers company have helped his family out?
Any help gratefully received.

[ciderdrinker]

Hi
There's a record of James Ramshaw's apprenticeship in 7.7.1789 to a William Morgan printer and stationer on Ancestry.
James is the son of James Ramshaw the elder of Jeavering bower school master Essex.
James is receiving his freedom of the City of London papers and it is that record which is on there.
Ciderdrinker

[miriamkinga]

There's a reference to James here also: -

http://bookhistory.blogspot.co.uk/2007/01/london-1775-1800-r.html

[Bookbox]

Does anyone have access to early records of stationers / printers in London.

Have you checked the British Book Trade Index?

http://www.bbti.bham.ac.uk/SearchNotice.htm

Records of stationers etc. are mostly not deposited. They are held at Stationers' Hall, but there is a lot of published information too. St Bride's Library is the place to visit, if you can get there. They have an online catalogue.

http://stbride.org/

[gracem]

[There's a record of James Ramshaw's apprenticeship in 7.7.1789 to a William Morgan printer and stationer on Ancestry.
James is the son of James Ramshaw the elder of Jeavering bower school master Essex.
James is receiving his freedom of the City of London papers and it is that record which is on there.
]
Thank you! That confirms a suspicion. Is the date the start of his apprenticeship or the freedom of the city? I am wondering if I have 3 generations of James.
Mary Morgan m James Ramshaw 23May1795 (he was a bachelor). He died in 1855 aged 82 at 33 Fetter Lane where he had been living since at least 1810. The Exeter Working papers have a James at 7 Lombard Street Fleet Street in 1799 and I already had a reference to a James Ramshaw of 2 Dogwell Ct Whitefriars standing bail for a Charles Wise 16 Sep 1799.
If James age at death is correct then he was bn circa 1773 and would have been 16 in 1789 - old for an apprentice? but young for his freedom. If the date refers to the freedom then maybe William & James snr worked together. I think I am confusing myself!
I have quite a lot on the James junior as he invented a means of printing using steam avoiding having a fire for each press and allowing him to stop payig for fire insurance! He was also high in the Stationers Co for the branch near his home.

[ciderdrinker]

Hello
Yes the apprenticeship/Freedom of London document,the date 1789 is for him being made a Freeman of London ,so you're right he is a bit young.I expected him to be 18 or 21.
There are tax records for a James Ramshaw in Farringdon without from 1800-1854 .The 1800 is Dogwell Court and the 1854 Fetter Lane.1801-1811ish at  Nevills Court(to be honest I didn't look at every year)
For William Morgan,his taking on apprentices -Samuel Gray 17.7.1770,Thomas English 26.2.1784
William Morgan copper plater ,printer St Dunstan in the West -Thomas Ross 20.7.1776
I can't spot his own apprenticeship but then there are a lot of William Morgans and I could have missed one.
London tax 1780 William Morgan Lombard St next to Dogwell crt.He remains there until 1795.
1796 and the property is rented by Mrs Morgan.
1798 Mrs Morgan now Ramshaw
1800 and she has gone.
Strangely another William Morgan pops up in 1816 at Popes Head Alley,Lombard St,could be the same property.He stays there until 1828 when he is with a James Morgan and they are listed as stockbrokers.(This is only included on the 1828 before that he is plain William Morgan on his own,no occupation given).
Will do a bit more on them and get back to you
Ciderdrinker

[ciderdrinker]

Hi
There's a fire insurance policy for William Morgan copper plat printer Dogwell Crt 1780 om London lives website.
I assume you have William Morgan's Will of 1791.
I've checked Mary Morgan's marriage in 1795 and she's definitely a spinster so I think the tax collector made a mistake and assumed she was a Mrs.It's nice to think she took over her father's business.
Looking at William's 2 marriages Frances Smith 12.9.1774 St Dunston in the West and Jane D'vaule/Duval St James Clerknewell 5.2.1764 ,I think that the name Peter may have come from her side.Peter Duvall(his signature) /D'vaule(the vicar's )was one of the witnesses.
There are  2 baptisms for a William Morgan s of Peter I can spot  18.8.1754 to Peter and Mary wire drawer and 30.8.1745 to Peter and Ann pin maker which doesn't really go with a stationer.
Jeane Jane Duval was baptised 2.2.1742 at Threadneedle st to Pierre (Peter)Julien Duval and Marie Madeline Boulle.They came from Brittany and Auvergne.
They could well be Peter and Mary .
Ciderdrinker
ps think this is William's burial 12.2.1791 St Brides Fleet St age 57 died suddenly White Fields?
The information of his address is very faint but the line above is consumption and from workhouse.That would give a birth 1734.

[gracem]

Thank you so much for the information. I didn't have Williams burial in White friars before and the information about Jane Duvall is very exciting.
I must get a researcher to got to St Brides library to try to straighten things out as I am now wondering how many generations of William Morgan I have as well as how many James Ramshaw's.
If he died in 1791 he couldn't pay tax in 1795! or was this his wife / daughter carrying on his business under his name?
The early map maker John Ogilby and William Morgan (his step-son) produced a large scale map of london in 1676. The orignal print works had been destroyed in the Great Fire of London and new ones built at White friars. I have a suspicion that the property may have stayed in the family.. being rented out at times when they weren't using it. It is confusing as there is a Lombard Street in The City and Lombard Lane off Bouverie St in the middle of White Friars.

[ciderdrinker]

Dear Grace
I think you're right William's wife or daughter  must have been paying the tax for him and carrying on the business.I'm just as guilty.I got my Dad's TV licence renewal this morning and he's been dead 3 years.
I have found a burial for Frances too. At St Brides  1.10.1797 no 7 Lombard St White Friars ,again sudden death age 44 years.Your family do like going suddenly.
Apparently there is a book Stationers Company Apprentices Book 1701-1800 by Donald Francis Mckenzie they may be of use.An on line index of it gives a William Morgan apprentices in 1748 and made a freeman 1751 but there's no more detail.Presumably the real book would be better.
It would be lovely if could trace the Morgans back to the 1670's .Nice to think they had been in the same business for so long.
As for the Duvalls
Pierre Duvall  and Marie Madeline had the following children Pierre 12.8.1738-19.6.1743 (buried St Dunstan Stepney of Bethnal green weaver),Guillaime 30.1.1740,Pierre 12.11.1743,Jean 13.3.1745,Jeanne/Jane 2.2.1747,Marie 10.2.1752 and Jean Antoine 6.3.1755.


Ciderdrinker